Keith Inc.

On another forum, we were suggesting people to resurrect, just to see what they had to say. One came up with George Carlin, just because it would mess with the man's head. One problem, though, would be that George would have to come up with new material. I didn't think that would be all that big of a problem. "There i am in the afterlife, walking around, meeting people. And i see Jesus. He's wearing sunglasses so the Baptists won't recognize him, but i grew up Catholic. I know the guy on sight. He was in every classroom i was ever in, you know? "So, I ask Jesus, what the fuck is up with showing your face in toast? I mean, it's so whitebread. Why do you never see Jesus' face in the puke in the alley behind a gay bar? Or the stains in a freeway restroom in Jersey? "And he says: Well, George, i thought about it. And see, i don't mind people referring to puke as 'worshipping the porcelain god,' but i sure don't want it being referred to as one's 'come to Jesus moment.' No, he won't be lacking material.

Huh. I generally don't write celeb fics because i don't feel confident that i can get 'into character' enough to anticipate what they'd do or say.Morally, my writing process for an original or a fanfic is largely me pretending to be one or two characters and writing it down. I don't have that much of an issue pretending to be a real person.

I think you're saying that the threshold of disbelief is higher in one than the other, by virtue of the setting/character/source material?That makes sense. If i say that Bugs Bunny does something, you have an image of a cartoon in your head, not a man in a felt costume. If i say that Aver Rage does something, you have an image of a real person in your head and respond differently. It's either more real, or more easy to imagine as being real. Yeah. Also, in fanfic, there's an uphill battle against perceived characters. If i write that Gandalf's preoccupation with hobbits stems from a fetish for sex with tiny, tiny children, most fans would dismiss it. I'd get hate male for what i did to the character. If Aver Rage sexes a child, there's no preconception to fight. People accept it as real more readily because they have no expectations of what Aver would or would not do. The hate mail would center on what the character did. good point.

For me, if i spend large parts of my day thinking about parts of the story i've already written, or the parts i've figured out that come next, but can't figure a way to bridge between the two (I have chapters 1-4, and know what happens in 6, but can't jimmy up 5 to save my life), then that's my writer's block. If i go into my 'MUST WORK ON' directory and am surprised to find that story about the ficus molestor still in there, that's disinterest.

OOoh! Soooooo close. No, see, some of our work? Doing it wrong is literally a federal case. It's hard to meet budget if we have to remove all the computers and printers from a division because of classified material incorrectly handled. So it's 'without the customer finding out about the breaking of any laws' I'd hire you. Although that was just meant as a sample... Know anything about automated instructional materials software? Ever been in a Turkish Prison?

I was reading a discussion in another forum about failing the personality test that was part of an employment process. I think my office should use personality tests. A significant portion of the work force has military experience. We're starting to get new-hires who grew up in the esteem-friendly school system. It's not a good match. Maybe some basic 'this is to look forward to' questions? "If a new-hire at a military contractor firm violates national security, do you think it's appropriate for an employer to threaten their job? Their health? Their life?" "Do you have a problem with profanity used in the workplace to express anger? To underscore priority? As a comma?" "Which do you consider more important for job satisfaction: a. Getting a job done. b. Getting a job done without breaking any laws. c. Getting a job done without your boss finding out about the breaking of any laws. d. Getting a job done without the customer finding out about the breaking of any laws." "What do you consider to be the minimum amount of advance warning for business travel involving a change in time zones? Express your answer in minutes or hours. If your hiring interviewer promised you zero business travel from the home, you may use days." "Do you think that value is added to an exit interview by actually naming names and threatening lawsuits?" "Would you participate in an office pool to guess the date of the nervous breakdown of a coworker? Of a boss? Of your own breakdown?" "Which term would you say does NOT describe a new-hire who thinks an education is equal or superior to experience: a. Fresh meat. b. Fair game. c. The Human Dartboard."

Um...i think you only need one thread on this. And i'd say it was better in Aimless than here or promoting a story. I'm also wondering why you're defending yourself against a review that you apparently deleted? If you want to discuss it ,you should have left it. if you deleted it, that says you want to ignore it. Just what are you after, here? [/cent][/cent]

This would be an easy claim to substantiate. The author needs to get out more...

That's just it. I'm not advocating 'doing nothing.' The site already does something. I think that's quite fucking sufficient for a society pretending to be an enlightened one. The problems we have with readers or non-reading reviewers ignoring or skipping the warnings will not be improved by adding more warnings. Pretty much by definition.That said, "CONTRO:explanation within" seems like an intelligent way to do what i maintain is not necessary to do. Minimal change to the programming, one additional step for the author, burden of conscience upon the reader. The definition of the "CONTRO:See Chap1" code will need to address the level of controversy intended. Not just, as you say, because it's in the headlines or the Supreme Court at the time of writing, but because it stretches an already elastic envelope to the brink with content, mood or participants that offer the extremeness of squicking. Bestiality would be on that list, pedophilia. I'd need to add a Xenophilia discussion to my Lamia, to be certain. The vore. Maybe the MadScientist porn... And all Bible fanfic, just because the Faithful do not understand the point of fanfic. ( http://www.petitiononline.com/mod_perl/sig...i?as7gp9&1) Thanx. And while i'm willing to argue about nearly anything, i usually don't truly take offense until blood floes. Just exchanging opinions and gently exploring the fact that everyone but me is wrong.

That is, indeed, the tragedy of Poe's Law.

Huh? THey're all humans. Or humanoid enough to pass in the subway. Good Christ, none of these would make my top ten. Is it just the idea of a crossover that's offensive/baffling? Reminds me of a movie reviewer who commented on E.T. that a child used profanity in the first scene and it didn't even make sense. The word was 'penisbreath.' His next column was: "Okay, thank you for the letters, the pictures, the blueprints, the drawings and the wonderful poetry. I no longer think that the word is nonsensical. Dammit."

Would it? Luvin has responded only to the summary. No entry to the story to read any of the chappies, or any author's notes, or any introductory expanded summary. it would have to be a hard rule and everyone would have to know about it, for it to reduce the pain and heartache.Then again, so many people don't read the summaries, why wouldn't they just get into the habit of pouncing past the first chapter to get into the story its offensive self? And still, the point of the warnings should be sufficient for the purpose. The summary and Warnings aren't supposed to replicate the story in micro, just to raise interest and steer people towards or away from excitements or sticky ickiness, right? And hell, i've been reluctant to even fully list all the fandoms in the disclaimer at times, out of a fear that it telegraphs the twist-ending. I don't like the idea of taking time explaining how i don't support the language, violence, moral turpitude, rapes that follow, or the misogyny of the antagonist, or even identifying which hateful bastard in the story IS the antagonist... It'll just become too much like work to post a story, taking care to warn off and justify everything in it that might offend (which we CAN NOT do. I've posted stories and gotten thanx for including fetish elements i was not aware of. If i can turn them on by accident, be sure we can offend by accident.) If Kip or anyone else wants to take it on board as a suggestion, of course, more power to them. But anything remotely like a rule, however soft and slow, seems likely to cause more hate and discontent than it's likely to alleviate.

Oh, i hate writing summaries. I write a lot of fetish fiction, and those readers are very particular in what they want and what they don't want. If it's largely a Shrunken Women story, but there's one scene with Shrunken Men, the SW purists want to know not to waste there time. Which is hard to convey with the warning codes pulled from a list. I can't really indicate that it's 99% SW, 1% SM, but if i don't mention the SM, then i get hate on. The warning codes in the summaries are not meant to be spoilers, or book reviews or those story graphs they taught us in English Lit, with an opening of Xenophilia, climaxing with Virgin Fisting, then unicorn/centaur 'shipping in the denoument. The only thing you can really tell someone with the codes is: If you read this story, you will be faced with: male pregnancy, Chocolate dipping, bestiality, shrinking and MadScientist Intrusions. Not necessarily all at once, not necessarily happening to any given character. If the topic concerns you, don't go in there. I suppose one could go back into the summary and edit the codes for the ages of participants? (ANAL (adult); FIST(teen)) But this gets back to trying to be all things for all people. Can we adequately summarize an entire story for every single demographic that might be offended?

It's a continuing complaint on the forum that readers review a story and show surprise that it has exactly the content that was in the summary. Others do review to express disappointment that something that wasn't in the summary also wasn't in the story. People apparently skip reading the summary all the damned time. Not sure if they only read the adult warning, or number of reviews or how they choose what to read, but it ain't necessarily the author's effort to warn/advise/invite. Which is disappointing, since the things are so hard to write.

I guess there needs to be a rigid definition of Darkfic, but i would expect that to be driven by the mood of the story, not readers' reaction to it. If it's happysex, then people cruising Darkfic, looking for pervasive angst, necessary death, and all the stuff so many Goths seem to revel in, would the ones offended. Maybe (Adult, Adult+ and Adult++) need something further? (Socially Unredeemable+++) or (OMG!!!+++) or (Abandon all hope, ye who read beyond...)?? My Virgin&Unicorn story is not something i'd put in Darkfic, as a personal judgment. The sex is happy, the relationships striving to reach and stay upbeat. Except the death at the climax, but i don't think that anyone would find that the salient detail, so i'd think it a disappointment if someone surfing Darkfic read it. Although plenty of people are absolutely squicked by the topic, the subject, and the fandom it's written in. I even got GAFFed for it. Luvinfanfic, i don't think anyone is saying or expects that you, or anyone, has to be okay with the content. And like Jaxxy, i appreciate what it must take to post a dissenting view in such a thread, after all that's gone above. I guess the question is finding a disposition that serves the greatest number in the best way.

Shakedown?

Working on a sort of sequel. Earth has discovered the Giant planet, sent a Fleet of ships to it. They make a deal with the dominant government of the place, trading captured humans for Earth technology. An SID agent (a bit of a political misfit) and a human partner (plus a garrison of Marines) work on the Exchange in Coastal City (On a different continent from the TV show's setting). Trying to keep to the feel of the show, except for the characterizations. Irwin Allen never had any interest in characters that developed, i'm trying to fix that oversight. http://tv.adult-fanfiction.org/story.php?no=600093848

hate what you're saying, defend to the death your right to say it, sort of thing....?

Eh, hardware doesn't do a thing for me. But the idea of writing out a metaphor as full blown porno...that grabbed me around the throat and wouldn't let go.

Somewhere outside of Hershey, PA, we were traveling to our next tourism event when i saw an odd sight. Now, i know what happened. Someone was having a yard sale. They put a sign about four houses down on the side of the road, so people coming up to it would know it was there. And on the opposite side of the road, in the opposite direction, about as far. So, it kinda made sense. I mean, you see 'yard sale' signs all over in the summer, at least around where we live and apparently around here. Thing was, from my point of view it was different. All i saw was 'Yard Sale' on a piece of plywood at the edge of a cemetery...

Hell, i enjoy plastic meat. Those premade sandwiches in the gas station? I like a couple of those and a coke on a long drive.Thing is, i can tell the difference between those and a fillet Mignon. Some people can't. And, really, if you're ordering a hamburger because you like it more, that's saying something about your character. If a fictional character is described as liking hamburgers, but ordering the fillet exactly because it's more expensive, that says something different about that character.

i couldn't tell Prada from Knock-off Prada if i was chewing on the label, but some of my characters might. Well, no, not my characters. I can imagine some of them knowing the carat size of the woman's diamond, or the approximate value of their jewelry. Which would be a defining trait, if she's wearing a $5000 diamond or $300 worth of glass paste. And whether she knows the difference. If the man has a $20 haircut from the mall or a $400 haircut, that tells a lot about how vain he is. Or maybe how much a junior partner wants to impress the senior ones. In some circles, people gain celebrity for being connected to a Broadway play. Or an Off-broadway play. I don't really feel the difference viscerally, but to others, it's an important mark of status. In the setting, that may be an important trait. My kids seem to be terribly concerned with the shoes they and others are wearing. I haven't been that concerned with shoes since boot camp. On the other hand, as several point out, they're not all distinctions that everyone can immediately grasp. Except money. So there could be a line in there about 'Between the Prada and the Gucci, the director's visible worth was at least $500 more than her assistant's.' Or some other way to convey why it is important that the man is ordering Fillet Mignon vice the hamburger. is it for the calories? The cost? An appreciation of the finer things in life? A passion for things with French Names? I would say that the author should use these extra clues to define a character, but keep in mind that not everyone is a fashionista.

no, no, not saying to be confrontational. Just not to give in to the sort of baseless intimidation in the email. Anyone can make threats like that, for a variety of what they find objectionable. If there really is a legal leg to stand on, to support their side, then actual legal action would move it from intimidation to an action legal problem. If anything, do not reply to the letter in the tone the letter has taken. 'Up Yours' would probably come back to bite you in the ass if this goes anywhere. Trying to explain your (our? Sanity's?) side would be a bit better, but i feel it would bounce off their armor. I'd say that any response would be wrong, as in moving the conversation forward. it's a bad conversation. It's threats and closed-mindedness. I actually think some of our posters here would agree with him to a certain extent, but most of the comments i've noted here on that subject at least seem to have the tone of 'in my opinion' rather than 'it cannot be gainsaid.' Though if you must reply, i'd lean towards the form letter. "Thank you for your email expressing your concerns for our site content. Your opinion is important to us. We are in the middle of an overhaul of your favorite incredibly smutty porn site right now, but rest assured that someone will be reviewing your concerns in the near future."