Who are the real Hotties? Confused World.

[Guest Avery]

Hey, I'm new to the board. My name is Avery, I read alot of slash and may post a story in the future...the only problem is I like to write a whole, or at least a half written, story before I post it.

Anyways...this is a question that has been digging itself ever so slowly into my skull...Who are the real Hotties?

I see alot of writers of slash create main characters who are male, 5'2", long hair, girly face, able to get impregnanted, three vaginas or whatever, if you're a slash reader or writer you know exactally what I'm talking about since about 98% of the stories include these type of characters. I admit, love these characters. These are the kind of guys I like. But how come if so many people write about these guys no one has nor seems to give voice about wanting one.

How come I see females, some who I know love slash, with the average joe 5'11"-6'4" dude with average muscles and regular guy look. Is there something I'm missing here?? Is it that people actually idolize the main characters and want to be them rather than have one?

Please, solve this perplexing conundrum for me by giving your opinion.

Thank you.

[Mourningstar]

Hmm, I've never thought of that before. Could be because, despite the fact that I love slash, I'm not the least bit into that type of characters.

It's true that I've written a couple of stories with characters who could be defined a bit more feminine-looking that the average real life male, but those have actually been gift fics. When it comes to characters I favour, they're almost always very masculine and quite often with traits that make them physically and/or mentally dominant.

When it comes to real life, I think your hypothesis rings somewhat true. Then again, there aren't all that many 5'2", long haired, girly faced guys around. Well, at least not here. Another thing could be that, although these females are unconventional enough to write slash and such characters, some part of their social coding is still held back enough to feel that in reality that kind of male is still somewhat unacceptable as a mate.

Maybe it's my caveman gene kicking in, but personally I like my guys tall, tough and buff, and my girls at least tough. I'm not sure I'd even know what to do with a guy only 5'2", other than to lean down a lot of the time...

[Iggy_lovechild]

Well...In my case writing slash is rather personal. We'll just leave it at perhaps you're not that far off when you wonder if some writers want to be the male characters that they write about.

Of course, given my track record, I actually can't stand the typical girly-boy bullshit. Mind you, I love beautiful men. Men with smooth skin and lush mouths, but I also like a measure of masculinity. When I write about two men in love/fucking, I want to write about two men, not one man and some adrogynous mess.

[NightScribe]

I agree with nikola and Iggy; MANLY MEN please, I'm totally old school. Consider this though:

teen pop idols and a lot of actors nowadays. Very few rough and tumble, deep voiced Robert Mitchum, Gregory Peck, Clark Gable types, you know? Men who were men, sounded and looked masculine (baritone voices make me swoon ) I think part of it is that some (female) writers do a bit of self-insertion with the "girlier" character and some of them (not on this site I hope) are young teenagers. "Softer" looking/sounding men are less threatening. Broad shouldered, deep voiced gents have that aura of danger and experience that could be "frightening" to a 13 yr old. This even extends to operas and musicals. The young hero or love interest is usually sung by a tenor and the sidekick, comic relief, villain, father figure is sung by a baritone or bass baritone (due to the "color" of the voice). I never really got that; why fall for a guy who can almost sing as high as you? Sorry, I'm digressing, but just thought I'd put in my opinion.

[Guest Jackie_Boi]

I agree with the last three comments. I like MEN lol. I usually can't stand the girly men, but, if the writer does a good enough job I can look past it. I also think for alot writers they write these stories because it's a fantasy that they would one day like to live, although they know they probably never will. It's probably just an escape from reality =/

That's why I write anyway.

[StoryJunkie]

woo! wait til Alien Pirate Pixagi sees this thread! She's got the corner on hating girly-guys in said stories. Observe

[Guest Agaib]

*rolls eyes* Being a bisexual Dominant male I'd like to say that I don't think I would willingly have sex with a person that seemed like a girl with a penis (not to mention that dickgirl thing that seems to crop up on the internet all the time, *shudder*).

I already have a nice female partner I'm quite comfortable with at the moment. However, If I was to pick a guy I'd want it to be a guy I can get feminine in a woman whenever I want.

I feel sorry for this poster though, we're kind of bashing what he/she(probably she) said he/she really liked. Though I do have to comment that perhaps next time you should look over your post more carefully. For some reason I had to glance over it a few times before the question sunk in.

The underlying issue is that the overly feminine man that is commonly presented such fiction is not a common commodity. The reason those writers don't actually look for a man that behaves in such a fashion is because they're still adhering to gender stereotypes. Even though we have a man being feminine, they are still showing that they believe every relationship should have a feminine counterpart. By seeking a feminine man, they would be breaking the rules to be feminine themselves, and not many women are willing to do that.

hope that answers your question.

[Guest Avery]

Wow...alot of you like real MEN apparently.

I feel sorry for this poster though, we're kind of bashing what he/she(probably she) said he/she really liked.

No hard feelings at all. I'm glad to like who I like.

Agaib, you're right. I somehow forgot to write the actual question in my post. I somehow skipped around it the whole time. Not exactally sure how I did that.

Alot of you, however, said that you like to read...or write...your stories about more masculine or real men...so I'm still wondering about the answers of those who read/write about the more feminine ones.

Then again, there aren't all that many 5'2", long haired, girly faced guys around. Well, at least not here.

They are really hard to find. Though there are some. Sadly though, about 3/4 of them have a Napolean complex (there's an actually name for it, but what I mean to say is the shorter, the worse of a personality because they're trying to make up for looking unmanly by acting overly manly)

And NightScribe, you're right - I keep seeing masculinity fading more and more in movie stars, etc. of today. I think men of the future will (hopefully) keep getting less and less masculine. I've read that sperm rate has decreased 30% in the last 30 years. (though that may or may not be true lol) I just wish I had been born farther into the future so I could see it.

[EveKnight75]

I think what it comes down to is that everyone has different personal tastes when it comes to potential partners.

Avery prefers more "feminine" men, and that's perfectly fine. However, there are plenty of cases where the type of men someone fantasizes about is different from the type of men that same someone would actually want to be with. Same applies to types of women.

I'm a bisexual female who reads slash. I have yet to post any slash, but it may happen in the future.

Like Agaib, I like to keep my men separate from my women. I want women who are women and men who are men. Then again, there are degrees of "femininity" that I find acceptable or even attractive in men.

First of all, let's distinguish between "feminine" and "effeminate". The girly-boy stereotype in slash fiction is considered "effeminate", and can often be ridiculous. "Feminine" means that the guy possesses certain qualities that are stereotypical of a woman, but doesn't go overboard with it.

Effeminate men are a sexual turn-off for me. Men who aren't afraid of expressing their "feminine" qualities are actually appealing, so long as they don't go girly on me. If he's not embarrassed to cry in front of me, if he's not afraid to admit that he cares about what he wears, if he's not afraid to watch a chick flick and admit that he actually liked it (only if he really did), then I just may be interested in him. If he cries often, if he's obsessed with his appearance, and if he can't stand a gory action flick (featuring vampires of course), then I suggest he look elsewhere. To be more clear about it, I find metrosexual men very attractive, but from a sexual stand point, I can't stand a girly-boy (though I do have friends who are).

I do prefer a baritone, but I don't mind a middle tone. I can't stand guys who sound falsetto, or who have squeaky/nasal tones in their voices. Rough/husky is OK with me. I won't complain about a guy's height provided he's taller than me (shouldn't be that hard - I'm only 5'2"). I don't like long hair but longish hair can work on a lot of guys, provided it doesn't cover their eyes or goes past their neck. I don't think I'd ever date a trans.

I'm not attracted to overly "masculine" straight men either. It's not an issue because they're not attracted to my personality. These men are a bit obsessed with adhering to the masculine stereotype, have homophobia issues, and are so insecure that they refuse to try anything they consider remotely "girly" and won't accept it in other men either. They also have issues dating women who are not meek or submissive, and turn out intelligent and opinionated. The overly masculine gays come off less irritating because the sexual security issues aren't as rampant (though they do have this need to be dominant), and I would definitely consider dating an overly masculine bisexual man.

When I read slash fiction, I don't mind men who are on the short side, men who have high voices, or men who have long hair. Hell, I'm pretty tolerant of a male character who possesses all three of these qualities, so long as there's something masculine in their character to balance it out. The thing is, men who look like that exist in real life.

I'd have to draw the line at m-preg. Unless it is extremely well-done, I don't want to read it. If the male has a vagina, the author had better make us fully aware of the sex-change operation that occurred previously in the story and give us a transgender/transsexual warning.

The really girly gay man does exist in real life, but the trick with writing one is to avoid clichéd stereotypes and insulting people in the process. When you couple a submissive girly-boy with a dominant overly-masculine gay man, you end up promoting negative stereotypes and display a lack of knowledge about homosexuality.

I think if I did write an effeminate man, I'd throw in something uncommon about the character just for the sake of realism. Perhaps I'd make him straight, or gay dominant, or he doesn't wear make-up or dresses despite the fact that he knows plenty about them. Perhaps I'd give him a dark edge to make it clear that he's not someone you can easily make fun of or take advantage of.

It's all in how well you write the character and the relationship, and how careful you are when working with it.

As for males being more effeminate in the future, I doubt that. I think we'll manage to be more sensitive to men who don't comply with the male stereotype, but I think there'll be plenty of men who obviously have testosterone even if they're less fertile.

I think the type of man Avery could conceivably be attracted to are the foppish men from old aristocratic Europe. Back then, "foppish" wasn't a slur and I don't mean it as one. You know, the men who were effeminate but straight because it was the "in" thing.

So there you go. Someone who's kind of in the middle with a strong attraction to metrosexual men, and a woman who's attracted to both sets of gender qualities.

[NightScribe]

You're right nikola, I haven't written any slash, but I do read some from time to time and the ones I enjoy are where both men are masculine, not one masculine the other feminine. There's plenty of het stories out there to fill that need. I guess it irks me because it's the idea/stereotype (did Eve mention this or Agaib?) that one half of the pairing has to play the "female" role.

I'll leave it to the slash writers to duke this one out.

[Iggy_lovechild]

Well, Avery, I don't know who writes those stories, because all of the women who've commented in this thread don't regularly write Slash fics as far as I know.  Nightscribe, you write in the Harry Potter genre mostly, don't you?  And Iggy writes alot  of FF7.

*arches eyebrows* Actually all I write is for m/m couples these days. Mind you, I haven't written original fiction in a long while now, but if I did finally get off my ass and get on that, it would still be about men in love and lust.

Hmm...Though i feel like I've misrepresented myself a little bit. I mean, I like more femenine men as well, i just don't like the girly-boy bullshit as portrayed in most yaoi. It's so difficult to explain because a lot of people assume that pretty=weak, which isn't true at all. I guess what I'm trying to say is that I dislike a submissive, clingy personality on men, which a lot of the worst uke stereotypes embody.

[Guest Alien Pirate Pixagi]

I think the first thing I fell for when I really started to fall for my significant other is his somewhat effeminate personality. That said, he's still plenty man where it counts. The same goes for most of the characters I write. I don't like the little pretty boy. If I'm dating/fantasizing about a guy with a guy, it's a bout a GUY with a GUY. I'm bisexual, therefore, if I want it pretty and delicate, I'll look for lesbian fics/chicks.