Solved

[Shadowknight12]

Solved.

Edited June 17, 2012 by Shadowknight12

[wanderingaddict]

dude your wood elf is HUGE! 6'4"?? DnD elves like, barely top 5 feet!

[Shadowknight12]

dude your wood elf is HUGE! 6'4"?? DnD elves like, barely top 5 feet!

HeroForge (a spreadsheet for D&D) has a height/weight/age randomiser for the most common races. I kid you not, that's what I got. But maybe there's a mistake? I'll check if it's possible.

EDIT: Races of Faerun gives the randomiser for a male wood elf as 4'10'' + 2d10 inches. 6'4'' is, in fact, within the possibilities.

EDIT 2: Hmmm, might prove to be a distracting detail, though. I'll cut him half a foot.

Edited December 2, 2010 by Shadowknight12

[wanderingaddict]

it's okay. it's cute. but like, wow, ridiculous much? that's like, some crazy height difference from 90% of the other elves of Faerun! you should keep it though. you can just say that his father was a tree.

[BronxWench]

First of all, I like the premise of the link between them via the rune. I really do, and I am very eager to see what you do with it. The whole notion of the characters as "destined for glory" is also wonderful, because in this fandom it's a given that our characters are going to be glory seekers, and it's a total pain in the ass to try and pretend that they are not.

The DnD elf height thing is variable, I think, depending on the edition you're using. Personally, I hate the "short, cute elf" thing, and prefer my elves to be closer to human height, albeit slimmer in build. I can do lithe, I can do graceful, but I like a little height in my men.

What I'm really intrigued by is your half water elemental. There's so much leeway in playing with that sort of character, and the lore? Oh, gods, tons of fun there! Are you going to use the genasi stats, or try and blend human/water elemental on your own and create something unique? Either way, I'm drooling!

[wanderingaddict]

lol, I'm the total opposite, Wenchy. I either like my elves lanky and tall as all get-out (6'4" and above baby!) or cute and tiny and basically tall halflings. the half-water elemental is pretty crazy though. in fact, all of these guys are pretty crazy, heh, what with an asimir and a tiefling in the same party and the crazy multi-classing action. plus I like the idea of her shadow moving on its own, lawlz. so much humor will be coming from that, I predict.

[Asexual Biped]

Two things:

1) Please state their genders before we read their backgrounds. ^^ It was a bit confusing trying to decipher what they were.

2) You stated that the second person listed, the one that lost his man, was stuck in the past and yet he didn't dwell in the past on separate occasions.

Other than that, I like them! ^^

[Shadowknight12]

it's okay. it's cute. but like, wow, ridiculous much? that's like, some crazy height difference from 90% of the other elves of Faerun! you should keep it though. you can just say that his father was a tree.

Actually, I checked the other elves and that's pretty much the norm for ALL elves in Faerun (sun and moon elves are slimmer, but just as tall). The only ones who get different height tables are Avariel (5'0''+2d8 for males) and drow (same as the standard elf of the Player's Handbook, which would be 4'5'' +2d6 for males). I think Forgotten Realms was aiming for a Tolkien version of elves. Kind of.

LMAO, shooting for a 'morning wood' pun?

First of all, I like the premise of the link between them via the rune. I really do, and I am very eager to see what you do with it. The whole notion of the characters as "destined for glory" is also wonderful, because in this fandom it's a given that our characters are going to be glory seekers, and it's a total pain in the ass to try and pretend that they are not.

The DnD elf height thing is variable, I think, depending on the edition you're using. Personally, I hate the "short, cute elf" thing, and prefer my elves to be closer to human height, albeit slimmer in build. I can do lithe, I can do graceful, but I like a little height in my men.

What I'm really intrigued by is your half water elemental. There's so much leeway in playing with that sort of character, and the lore? Oh, gods, tons of fun there! Are you going to use the genasi stats, or try and blend human/water elemental on your own and create something unique? Either way, I'm drooling!

Thank you! I got the idea of the mark from Planescape: Torment, combining that with Lathander's plan to do some wacky hijinks that would forever change the setting (Faiths and Pantheons calls it "the Deliverance") and the plot from NWN gave me this particular plot bunny. And yes, exactly! Faerûn is this huge hotbed of monsters and archmages and adventurers wanting to make a name for themselves. Nobody (that I know of) explores all the nasty things that come with glory. Well, let me just say this: it's not going to be a bed of roses.

Yeah, it really does vary a lot from edition to edition. Why, look at 4E, we have elves (5'4''-6'0'') and eladrin (5'5''-6'1'') who are both slightly shorter than humans (5'6''-6'2''). I think the 'short, cute elves' thing is a holdover from Greyhawk, D&D's "official" setting for 3E. As I mentioned above, you can see from the setting's history and lore that FR has taken a much more traditional take on elves, preserving a very Tolkienesque feel. LOL, I don't mind short, cute little elves at all. They have their own... ahem, unique charm.

Hah, no! Half-elemental is a perfectly viable template from Manual of the Planes that I slapped upon a Rashemi human. I was originally going to make her an aquatic fey of some sort (rusalka, sirine, etc.) but then I opted for a more human angle. Mainly so that I can do the "mad fey" thing in another story later on. The awesome thing about half-elemental is that it doesn't need to be a cross-breed thing, like half-celestial, half-dragon and the like (since elementals can't reproduce sexually). Instead, you're encouraged to come up with your own justification for the template. Mine, in this case, is that the water elemental bonded with her out of gratitude, and serves her until it feels its debt has been repaid. The spirit wolf, on the other hand, is the spirit shaman's spirit companion given a background. She didn't just get one automatically when she took her first level in the class, she actually had to go out and get herself one. And heh, I think she's probably my favourite character. Mainly because she lets me get really creative in her speech. If you asked her what would she want for dinner, she might stare at you blankly (with the creepy misty eyes!) and say "the tears of a thousand ghosts, the dark breeze of Amn, the flesh of the death-rider that never stops to rest, that never sleeps, that never dies." And Nephis, which is likely the sanest character of the bunch, would probably reply something like "Sorry love, we're all out of those. Here, have some stew."

lol, I'm the total opposite, Wenchy. I either like my elves lanky and tall as all get-out (6'4" and above baby!) or cute and tiny and basically tall halflings. the half-water elemental is pretty crazy though. in fact, all of these guys are pretty crazy, heh, what with an asimir and a tiefling in the same party and the crazy multi-classing action. plus I like the idea of her shadow moving on its own, lawlz. so much humor will be coming from that, I predict.

Oooh, yes. Tall and lanky is hot. And so is cute and tiny. And hell, I could go for a human-sized, bulky, gladiator-style elf too (barbarian wild elves, mrowr!). But anyway, yeah, they're all pretty crazy. The thing is that I was aiming for a more realistic approach to your typical fantasy backgrounds (the sneaky thief being unable to form deep relationships, the guy hounded by a fiend becoming incredibly paranoid, the knight on a quest to revive his lover being shone not in a heroic, romantic light, but as a deeply self-deluded man, the mad seer being... well, truly insane and not just cryptic, etc.). The aasimar and the tiefling will probably banter a lot. It's just how those things work. But then again, the snark quotient in this party is through the roof.

The multiclassing thing (with Gestalt, even! Talk about self-indulgence right there!) was just for fun. It's a story, not a game, and if I want a sneaky wizard, a bardic paladin, a witchy cleric or a woodsy swordsman, I can just flick my magic fingers and voilà, it happens. But I kind of like building the characters, to set myself boundaries for what they can and can't do (which helps me with the drama throughout the story, not to mention the fight scenes). Besides, the prestige classes I picked change the character in some way. Nightsong Infiltrator is all about teamwork, which is precisely what Nephis lacks, and Shadowcrafter serves to emphasise her wholehearted devotion to illusion/shadow magic. Seeker of the Song is a personal journey for Arivan to learn how to express his grief, while Heartwarder is him reaching to to Sune for consolation. Divine Oracle and Contemplative are pretty self-explanatory, they're all aspects of divine, perhaps madness-inducing wisdom. Dervish is the manifestation of Ruathiel's prowess with the blade, Highland Stalker is the result of his constant, paranoid escape and pursuit through the wilderness. And with Aeron, well, the guy is really THAT devoted to Lathander (and packs a surprising punch). Either way, I'm doing it mostly for the fluff and to spice up my fight scenes. I think it's important to know what your characters are (and most importantly, aren't!) capable of. It can serve as a good source of tension and drama to exploit your characters' weak spots and test their teamwork skills.

And LMAO, yes. Especially with twitchy guy. "Did your shadow just move on its own?!?!" "Yes, yes it did. It does that at times. Must be hungry. *winks*"

Two things:

1) Please state their genders before we read their backgrounds. ^^ It was a bit confusing trying to decipher what they were.

2) You stated that the second person listed, the one that lost his man, was stuck in the past and yet he didn't dwell in the past on separate occasions.

Other than that, I like them! ^^

1) DOH.

2) Erm, yes, that's actually true, contradictory as it sounds. He doesn't like thinking about what happened at all, telling himself over and over that he'll get the cash, find himself a high-level cleric to cast True Resurrection and it will all snap back to how it was. In order to move on, he must confront his past, deal with it and accept it. He's not doing any of that. Am I making any sense here?

Thanks all for your comments! Feel free to point out anything else that catches your eye!

[Asexual Biped]

Ah, ok! I understand now. That makes sense. :]

[wanderingaddict]

is this a separate edition you're checking? because I'm, like, really, really, really... really certain the elves in DnD lore are short. like, they hit 5 feet flat (on average). I mean, in every NwN game they're short, in all the Drizzt books they're short, and like, in all the art they're short?

haha, and yeah, just the simple fact that they're called wood elves (heh, heh, "wood") is one of the few cases that I would simply never be able to stop laughing during sex (wood elf got wood! would be my snickering mantra the entire time).

[Shadowknight12]

is this a separate edition you're checking? because I'm, like, really, really, really... really certain the elves in DnD lore are short. like, they hit 5 feet flat (on average). I mean, in every NwN game they're short, in all the Drizzt books they're short, and like, in all the art they're short?

haha, and yeah, just the simple fact that they're called wood elves (heh, heh, "wood") is one of the few cases that I would simply never be able to stop laughing during sex (wood elf got wood! would be my snickering mantra the entire time).

Races of Faerun is 3.5E, and official published material. Checking the Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting (3.0E)... Yup! Vital Statistics in page 39 clearly states "Most characters in the Forgotten Realms campaign setting use the normal height and weight values given on Table 6-6: Random Height and Weight, page 93 of the Player's Handbook. However, elves in Faerûn are tall and thin, so all elves except drow use the human height and the half-elven weight, subtracting 10 pounds from the actual weight. Half-elves use the human height and the half-elven weight entries. Drow use the elven height and weight entries." They might be short in most D&D lore, but Faerûn clearly states otherwise. Apparently pretty much everybody missed this? Or was it too much of a hassle to remember? Oh, well.

EDIT 2: Doing the math, average elf height comes out at 5'8'' for the males and 5'3'' for the females. Maybe everyone in the novels/games/art is exceedingly average?

ROFL! "Wood elf got wood!" That's the funniest shit I've heard all day, dude.

At least it's better than their other name, 'copper elves,' which implies that they charge pretty cheaply for that hardwood of theirs.

[BronxWench]

lol, I'm the total opposite, Wenchy. I either like my elves lanky and tall as all get-out (6'4" and above baby!) or cute and tiny and basically tall halflings. the half-water elemental is pretty crazy though. in fact, all of these guys are pretty crazy, heh, what with an asimir and a tiefling in the same party and the crazy multi-classing action. plus I like the idea of her shadow moving on its own, lawlz. so much humor will be coming from that, I predict.

Oh, I like my humans tall and lanky as well. Nice tall man, something to absolutely climb, gods, I'm a goner. Just shove me up against that tree trunk, let me get my legs around your hips, and... shit.

I'm loving the multi-classing myself, and yes, the dynamics are going to be pure fireworks with an aasimar and a tiefling in the same party. (And can I say I like the sexy middle-aged tiefling? ). I'm already writing a genasi and the race is incredibly fun to write.

At least it's better than their other name, 'copper elves,' which implies that they charge pretty cheaply for that hardwood of theirs.

I had to edit to say I nearly choked to death on my coffee when I read this. That was fecking wonderful!

Edited December 3, 2010 by BronxWench

[wanderingaddict]

haha or maybe that's what they charged to handle the hardwood of others! haha, anyways, I guess we're both kinda right? so it breaks down like this:

the elves of Forgotten Realms (and by extension Faerun) ARE taller and use human height tables, which is a pretty big change from the standard third edition handbook of DnD general. NwN games use the general edition for their elves because they wanted it to be used for general DnD play, *and* the Drizzt book elves are all based off of general third edition race-rules, rather than Forgottem Realms (maybe they were before?) so all the elves in the "general lore" tend to be based off of those rules, set by that precedent, rather than the actual height tables outlined in the Forgotten Realms handbooks.

huh, the things you learn eh?

[Shadowknight12]

Oh, I like my humans tall and lanky as well. Nice tall man, something to absolutely climb, gods, I'm a goner. Just shove me up against that tree trunk, let me get my legs around your hips, and... shit.

I'm loving the multi-classing myself, and yes, the dynamics are going to be pure fireworks with an aasimar and a tiefling in the same party. (And can I say I like the sexy middle-aged tiefling? ). I'm already writing a genasi and the race is incredibly fun to write.

I had to edit to say I nearly choked to death on my coffee when I read this. That was fecking wonderful!

Something hard and tall to climb? *snerk* We're on fire with the wood references today!

Especially since they're both worshippers of very similar deities. The innuendo alone...! And hah, the "Overage" thread left me thinking it's a shame we don't see more sexy, sultry, confident middle-aged women around. That aren't, you know, villains or secondary characters. Oooh! What element? I like Water the best, though Air comes close.

LOL, thank you! But really, what were they expecting, naming elven subraces the same way as they order coinage? We ARE going to draw the necessary implications, folks! (I wish they would have gone with star elves = platinum elves, instead of mithral, since that way we could have called them "the priciest whores in Faerûn!")

haha or maybe that's what they charged to handle the hardwood of others! haha, anyways, I guess we're both kinda right? so it breaks down like this:

the elves of Forgotten Realms (and by extension Faerun) ARE taller and use human height tables, which is a pretty big change from the standard third edition handbook of DnD general. NwN games use the general edition for their elves because they wanted it to be used for general DnD play, *and* the Drizzt book elves are all based off of general third edition race-rules, rather than Forgottem Realms (maybe they were before?) so all the elves in the "general lore" tend to be based off of those rules, set by that precedent, rather than the actual height tables outlined in the Forgotten Realms handbooks.

huh, the things you learn eh?

ROFL! I can already imagine the "expert woodworkers" jokes, too...

*nods* I agree. They wanted to make the games, art and the books more concordant with D&D as a whole (perhaps as a selling point?), and there's probably more of those tiny details that were changed to promote the system and/or the setting.

Indeed! I have to say I hadn't realized it was an official difference before today (since I usually either set height myself).

[wanderingaddict]

you know, what's even crazier is that the face of DnD, the Salvatore books, all use the third edition ruleset for elves, making them all shorties, and even the latest books, the ones about the "death" of Eilisteae and all the other gods and the "making the way" for 4th edition (that are also set in Faerun?) all also have the elves as shortstacks. I wonder if they had a change of heart and saw this as a way to make their elves stand out? or if the general edition DnD has simply appropriated the Sword Coast for their own purposes? it's really weird, because this is like... kind of a big discrepancy you know? you'd think they'd have some sorta clear statement about their reasonings for this

[BronxWench]

My genasi is air, mostly because I liked some of the racial characteristics for that subtype, ie, being able to forgo breathing (very handy) and limited levitation.

But it really is strange how the supposedly canon literature ignores the FR rules. I do remember in one of the books, a drow male who was considered quite tall, and the snark was that there was human in his background somewhere for him to be tall. I'm thinking he was supposed to be 6', but I could be wrong on the exact height.

And for the record, I am doing my best to ignore 4e.

[Shadowknight12]

My guess? A good chunk of people simply missed that detail, since the elves from the OTHER settings (Greyhawk, Eberron, Spelljammer, Ravenloft, Planescape, Dark Sun, etc.) are pretty much universally like those in the Player's Handbook. And those who didn't, preferred to go with the flow instead of rocking the boat. Since it was, you know, a direct lifting from Tolkien's elves and not an original take on them.

Well, 4th edition doesn't happen, officially, until Mystra bites the dust and the Spellplague hits. Swordmage is set in 4e, and you see sorcerers with wands (Oh, how I'd wish that was a clever euphemism!) and all that 4e stuff. Also, poor, poor Eilistraiee. She was just so cool. I mean, seriously, a goddess whose entire clergy dances naked while wielding swords? How the fuck do you kill someone THAT cool?

But anyway! Apparently, I think they chose to go with the old 'shorter elves,' since in 4e all settings have the exact same cosmology, races, spells, etc. So subraces are just a colour/cultural difference. The only mechanical aspect I recall is a feat option. But yeah, the Sword Coast has been propped up as D&D's major selling point, with Icewind Dale, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, etc. Just like Sigil became Planescape's emblem and Sharn became Eberron's.

Heh, D&D has changed hands a lot in the past few decades. I've read some stories from past developers and it's clear that executive meddling played a big role in D&D's history. This is the typical sort of thing that a manager would have said "Okay, for your book, make the elves shorter, like in Greyhawk." "But Faerûn's elves are tall and thin..." "Bah, that's just trite and boring. We need innovation! We need VISION." "..."

[Shadowknight12]

My genasi is air, mostly because I liked some of the racial characteristics for that subtype, ie, being able to forgo breathing (very handy) and limited levitation.

But it really is strange how the supposedly canon literature ignores the FR rules. I do remember in one of the books, a drow male who was considered quite tall, and the snark was that there was human in his background somewhere for him to be tall. I'm thinking he was supposed to be 6', but I could be wrong on the exact height.

And for the record, I am doing my best to ignore 4e.

Yeah, I have to admit, air genasi get all the cooler cosmetic traits. Levitate is pretty handy, I'll give you that. Breathless is pretty awesome, too.

Well, drow ARE supposed to be short, even in Faerûn. It's the rest that are lithe and tall and sleeeender.

...yeah. Same here.

[wanderingaddict]

lol this seemed appropriate to copy+paste here. I asked my roommate about this a couple hours ago. this was our conversation he blathers inanely for a bit. just ignore the WoW stuff.

ShadowsOfXanthos: raawrr!!

ShadowsOfXanthos: IM SO EXCITED

Uberfisch Priest: hi

ShadowsOfXanthos: hahaha, long time typing for two letters

ShadowsOfXanthos: mmm, all my characters feel so fresh so clean

Uberfisch Priest: leveling is really easy

Uberfisch Priest: I'm 24 in like, 2 days of play

ShadowsOfXanthos: yeah it is

ShadowsOfXanthos: i like it

ShadowsOfXanthos: cuz honestly

ShadowsOfXanthos: it gets harder from 25-50

ShadowsOfXanthos: so at 50 it feels normal

ShadowsOfXanthos: but you can get a bunch of peeps up a level or 3

Uberfisch Priest: haha

Uberfisch Priest: yeah

ShadowsOfXanthos: no im stoked... finally have a reason to try Elemental shamanism

ShadowsOfXanthos: BWAHAHA

ShadowsOfXanthos: WA HA HA HA

Uberfisch Priest: /ywan

ShadowsOfXanthos: haha

ShadowsOfXanthos: his Name is Stromberad

ShadowsOfXanthos: hes a dwarf

ShadowsOfXanthos: hes dumb, and his name is an Anagram for Storm Beard

ShadowsOfXanthos: it also sounds like Stongbad

ShadowsOfXanthos: it makes me smile!! *sigh*

Uberfisch Priest: ewwwwwww

Uberfisch Priest: dwaaaarves

ShadowsOfXanthos: I know right!?

ShadowsOfXanthos: i never wanted a real one till I wanted a joke character

ShadowsOfXanthos: i figure he missfires more than Renji

ShadowsOfXanthos: and when he gets drunk and angry, he exudes static electricit so his hair turns into a puff ball around his face

Uberfisch Priest: pfft you're do trystfrf

ShadowsOfXanthos: i dont catch your meaning there

Uberfisch Priest: so retarded

ShadowsOfXanthos: hahaha

ShadowsOfXanthos: i know! its awesome.... *sigh*

Uberfisch Priest: hey how tall are elves in DnD?

ShadowsOfXanthos: 4'10

ShadowsOfXanthos: to maybe...5'4

ShadowsOfXanthos: for men

Uberfisch Priest: dude I know right

Uberfisch Priest: this guy is saying wood elves can hit 6'4"

Uberfisch Priest: that almost all elves can

ShadowsOfXanthos: no thats almost verbatum out of the PLayer's hand book

Uberfisch Priest: "Races of Faerun is 3.5E, and official published material. Checking the Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting (3.0E)... Yup! Vital Statistics in page 39 clearly states "Most characters in the Forgotten Realms campaign setting use the normal height and weight values given on Table 6-6: Random Height and Weight, page 93 of the Player's Handbook. However, elves in Faerûn are tall and thin, so all elves except drow use the human height and the half-elven weight, subtracting 10 pounds from the actual weight. Half-elves use the human height and the half-elven weight entries. Drow use the elven height and weight entries." They might be short in most D&D lore, but Faerûn clearly states otherwise. Apparently pretty much everybody missed this? Or was it too much of a hassle to remember? Oh, well."

ShadowsOfXanthos: i mean i've always thought Elves should be smaller than humans, its what makes there agilty so spectacular

Uberfisch Priest: yeah

Uberfisch Priest: I know

Uberfisch Priest: I don't get what he's talking about

ShadowsOfXanthos: hmm, no according to, my 3edition manual

ShadowsOfXanthos: 3.5 miiiight be different

ShadowsOfXanthos: but it still seems extremely doubtful

ShadowsOfXanthos: also what dont you get, its pretty clear hes saying they should use Human statistics.

Uberfisch Priest: yeah I get that

Uberfisch Priest: what I'm saying is that I don't get how

Uberfisch Priest: he gets elves being tall

Uberfisch Priest: when like, every single piece of DnD stuff ever says that elves are short

ShadowsOfXanthos: cuz in one book they give them a taller stature

Uberfisch Priest: haha do you have a pdf version of your player handbook?

ShadowsOfXanthos: not anymore

ShadowsOfXanthos: i do wanna check the 3rd edition and 4th edition Faerun compendiums

Uberfisch Priest: huh

Uberfisch Priest: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elf_%28Dungeons_&_Dragons%29#Physique_.283rd_edition.29

Uberfisch Priest: forgotten realms/faerun elves ARE different

Uberfisch Priest: weird

ShadowsOfXanthos: now ima have to pick up my dusty old tomes when I get back home

Uberfisch Priest: haha no, apparently 3rd edition wasn't used for Forgotten Realms?

Uberfisch Priest: what's even weirder is that Salvatore uses 3rd edition for all his stories

Uberfisch Priest: whcich are set in forgotten realms

Uberfisch Priest: so forgotten realms elves, except drow, use human height talbes

Uberfisch Priest: ooooh my god

Uberfisch Priest: dude

Uberfisch Priest: so this demoness

Uberfisch Priest: tied up three night elf men in the middle of the woods

Uberfisch Priest: and the text for killing her is "Foul demon dominatrix! Get her heart!"

ShadowsOfXanthos: no I have the 3rd edition manual

ShadowsOfXanthos: thats the version that I played most

ShadowsOfXanthos: the one i know everything about

ShadowsOfXanthos: also the 3.5 stuff really didnt change anything except rangers

Uberfisch Priest: no this is the Forgotten Realms edition?

Uberfisch Priest: read the wiki page

Uberfisch Priest: about erlf physique

ShadowsOfXanthos: yeah, Forgotten Realms were the original D&D reals

ShadowsOfXanthos: I did

ShadowsOfXanthos: so 1st -4th editions

Uberfisch Priest: well I think it's really funny that Salvatore uses the third edition rule-set exclusively

Uberfisch Priest: in fact, I wonder if they dumped the original tall elves

Uberfisch Priest: because in the latest book where they kill Eilistreae the elves are short

ShadowsOfXanthos: elves were never tall

Uberfisch Priest: it says on Wiki that "the forgotten realms elves were tall"

ShadowsOfXanthos: yeah.... but wheres the reference

ShadowsOfXanthos: cuz I still dont believe it

ShadowsOfXanthos: the might be tall NOW, as of the world shift

ShadowsOfXanthos: which actually........

Uberfisch Priest: what? no

ShadowsOfXanthos: no

ShadowsOfXanthos: no the elves are STILL short

Uberfisch Priest: I'm saying I think there's a "Forgotten Realms" edition

Uberfisch Priest: like, a non DnD general edition

Uberfisch Priest: that uses elves as tall

ShadowsOfXanthos: Forgotten realms is ALL the editions

ShadowsOfXanthos: its a campaign setting and is Refurbished at the same time as General D&D

Uberfisch Priest: and there's a thread in the neverwinter nights forums where one person complaining about how halflings uddenly grew a foot?

Uberfisch Priest: is chastised by someone saying "look nobody cared when elves shrank"

Uberfisch Priest: so there's a height discrepancy somewhere

ShadowsOfXanthos: so when 3rd edition came out a whole bunch of new Forgotten realms books were released along with that updating rules etc

ShadowsOfXanthos: yeah no that world shift jogged a memory

ShadowsOfXanthos: so here is what happened

ShadowsOfXanthos: basically just like the cataclysm Faerun was "broken:

ShadowsOfXanthos: it colided with another sister realm

Uberfisch Priest: are you going to finish?

ShadowsOfXanthos: haha sry lorgs acsking about WoW

ShadowsOfXanthos: harde to hold 2 convos and youll be around later than him

Uberfisch Priest: I'm going to my uncle's soon

Uberfisch Priest: and his questions are boring nad lame

ShadowsOfXanthos: haha

ShadowsOfXanthos: anywho

ShadowsOfXanthos: yeah they split the elves into 2 races

ShadowsOfXanthos: in Forgotten realms

ShadowsOfXanthos: the Woodelves and the Eladrin

ShadowsOfXanthos: Elves and the Eladrin

ShadowsOfXanthos: so maybe ONE of those are tall now and the others arent

Uberfisch Priest: in 4th edition?

ShadowsOfXanthos: yeah

ShadowsOfXanthos: and honstly 3.5 is NOT something you should base any lore off of AT ALL

ShadowsOfXanthos: it came out for 3 reasons

ShadowsOfXanthos: #1 to Fix the Ranger and Druid classes to be competative

ShadowsOfXanthos: #2 to give WotC some extra fund for 4th

ShadowsOfXanthos: #3 to keep people busy with some pre-forth edition lore changes

ShadowsOfXanthos: which MIGHT have included an elf change

ShadowsOfXanthos: think about it like this

ShadowsOfXanthos: 1st Editon comes out 1980s or so

ShadowsOfXanthos: 2nd edition comes out early 1990s

ShadowsOfXanthos: 3rd edition in 2001 I think

ShadowsOfXanthos: and then 3,5 in 2008

ShadowsOfXanthos: 4th edition in 2009...

ShadowsOfXanthos: maybe it was 2007 for 3rd

ShadowsOfXanthos: 3.5

ShadowsOfXanthos: you can look up the times... but to put it bluntly... 3.5 is an outlier of an edition at best, and a terrible argueing point

Uberfisch Priest: hahaha

Uberfisch Priest: huh

Uberfisch Priest: "Elves are slender, athletic folk about as tall as humans. They have the same range of complexions as humans,"

Uberfisch Priest: http://dnd4.com/phb#7

Uberfisch Priest: 4th edition

so really... yeah, after 4e elves are tall? lol this was fun. why are your threads always so much fun, Snight?

[wanderingaddict]

lol, my roommate is actually very adamant that elves should be short, so those are his words that tall elves are stupid, not mine we've actually argued about whether elves can be tall (I like em tall and I like em short, so it was just me defending the idea). I just think it's ridiculous to have elves be... be what, slender, pretty humans? I mean, exact same heights, sans ten pounds with some pointy ears? please, give me my eyebrowed tall, lanky hotties from WoW any day over that boring ol' bull. ah well though. 4e has a lot of things that are really hard for people to swallow.

and did you read the book Snight? the author deliberately tried to keep it vague so that individual people can end it however they want.

[Shadowknight12]

lol this seemed appropriate to copy+paste here. I asked my roommate about this a couple hours ago. this was our conversation he blathers inanely for a bit. just ignore the WoW stuff.

so really... yeah, after 4e elves are tall? lol this was fun. why are your threads always so much fun, Snight?

I have one thing to say before I tackle the rest: ROFLMAO at the dwarf idea. I seriously laughed at that. Poor dwarves, nobody likes them. Though at least they're not gnomes or goblins...

Anyway, his idea that 3E was a moneymaker for 4E is so retarded I'm tempted to find this guy and bash his head against the nearest surface while I chant "Do. The. Research. Next. Time." over and over again. Heh.

But actually, if you look a bit lower in that link you have in the convo (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elf_(Dungeons_%26_Dragons)#Elves_in_the_Forgotten_Realms) you see that it's specifically states the height difference. So no, that was always there. It was just kind of like this tiny little exception that went against everything else. Sort of like the Darkspear tribe in WoW. Imagine if they weren't a playable race or part of the Horde. Would you remember there was a tiny little tribe in Kalimdor that wasn't evil and cannibalistic? Oh and also, there are GOOD drow now, they're brown and pretty, for those who want their elves in coffee and chocolate flavours. Oh, and werewolf elves, too. Granted, I'd still write smut with any of those. Yeah, I have no shame.

But seriously, it's a bit of obscure trivia that only crops up in like, two books. People probably forgot about that shit as the other settings gained prominence.

Lawl, I don't know! Maybe it's because wherever I go, chaos follows? And that's amusing? Maybe we'll never know!

lol, my roommate is actually very adamant that elves should be short, so those are his words that tall elves are stupid, not mine we've actually argued about whether elves can be tall (I like em tall and I like em short, so it was just me defending the idea). I just think it's ridiculous to have elves be... be what, slender, pretty humans? I mean, exact same heights, sans ten pounds with some pointy ears? please, give me my eyebrowed tall, lanky hotties from WoW any day over that boring ol' bull. ah well though. 4e has a lot of things that are really hard for people to swallow.

and did you read the book Snight? the author deliberately tried to keep it vague so that individual people can end it however they want.

HAH, it's okay, I fully agree with you. I like elves all over the spectrum. I'm on the fence with the weird-ass eyebrows. I don't know if they're exotic or supremely disturbing...Which book, the one where Eilistraiee dies? No, precisely because she dies, LOL. I've been very chaotic in my D&D novel reading. I haven't touched the Drizzt novels because I want to start from the beginning and go in order, not like the rest where I've been reading stuff without rhyme or reason (hey, I didn't know they were part of a series/trilogy/series of trilogies for a long time!).

[wanderingaddict]

yeah, I saw that on the wiki page, which is why I was like "where the hell is this coming from because I've seriously never heard mentioned anywhere else, ever." so I googled it, but aside from that quote on the NwN forums complaining in passing, there wasn't a thing (and I didn't care THAT much, lawlz) so I was all like HMM and asked my roomie, and with his greater historical knowedge of the DnD releases I was able to piece what'd happened together.

I honestly liked the author of the Eilistreae novels much more than Salvatore. Salvatore gets... kinda weird, as he progresses with Drizzt. the chick who had to kill Eilistrae (seriously, she says it in her author's note that her hands were tied) is pretty decent. easily much better than the other two authors in the series before her. the first novels of Drizzt, the first three novels/the Homeland volume (I think it's called) are actually worth it- because they explore him being born completely different deep in Drow society, and it's kind of fun because he's not superman (not yet ). but, seriously, like the moment he starts adventuring on the surface, in the first few chapters of the novel in the next series he single-handedly slays a milennia-old ice dragon and gets some huge armor upgrades and it's just like "... okay, what." kind of a disconnect from how powerless he was before.

and my roommate was saying that 3.5 was the moneymaker and not much else because there was hardly a year or two between its release and 4e, which, no matter how you look at it, is kind of a little suspicious, you gotta admit that.

honestly, there are only two alternative interpretations of elves that I have ever actually thought did them justice, and the crazy eyebrows of WoW, while realistically kind of weird, are stylistically an amazing way of readily defining elves from humans, without going into crazy artistic liscence. the only other style that I ever thought really justified them was one of the Magic: the Gathering sets, but anyways. I think your characters are prolly gonna be a ton of fun, and it'll be neat to learn about all these classes I've never heard of. lawlz, like, seriously, I live and breathe the story-lore of Faerun and the Sword Coast, but I don't know a damn thing about the actual game/any of the mechanics outside of the original NwN.

[Shadowknight12]

Well, it makes for good bit of trivia. Maybe even a few pick up lines. "Baby, I'm hung like an elf... from Faerûn." And if it doesn't work, you use their confusion to spike their drink. Win-win!

Poor woman. I wouldn't want to be in her position, being forced to write a plot you hate because the higher ups say so. Oh, lovely, we have another Anita in our hands. HEAT UP THE FURNACES, WE HAVE SNARK FUEL. Ayergh, so much literature to snark at! *adds Drizzt to his reading list*

From wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/D%26D --> 2000 (D&D 3rd edition); 2003 (D&D v.3.5); 2008 (D&D 4th edition). Not as much as the skip between 2E and 3E (that would be from 1989 to 2000), but yeah, they're not THAT close. Especially when it's widely renown that each edition after 3E was made pretty much with one thing in mind: Appease the fanbase who cried the game was broken and unbalanced. To nobody's surprise, such cries only did abate when 4E came out, which had been designed with that specific purpose in mind from scratch. Whiners proceeded to find new things to whine about. Mainly, "They Changed It, Now It Sucks."

But... eyebrows? I mean... eyebrows? I mean, sure, they flow with the whole "long ears, tall lanky frame" thing, but... weird much? Hm, you made me go googling for MtG elf art. A lot of them look fairly typical elves, but there are some that are albino pale and shave their heads. That's... disturbing. I surely hope you don't mean those. Though I'm glad you touched upon this topic, because I honestly hadn't thought of physical appearance or other visual stuff as a way to make elves different in original works. Definitely something to consider carefully.

Hah, well, if it was up to me, I'd do a looooot more with the classes. There's one called Initiate of the Sevenfold Veil that is all about abjuration (my favourite school of magic), and one called Sublime Chord that gives bards access to 9th level spells (Who's the spoony bard now?). But I had to choose and so I went with these. Maybe for some other stories in the future!

Sliiiiightly amused nobody mentioned a thing about the antagonist, lol. Especially the "Lawful Good and pretty nice guy" part. So anyway, are they seriously all 'good to go?' I must be doing something wrong here!

[Asexual Biped]

I didn't say anything about the antagonist because, just because they oppose the protagonist doesn't automatically mean they're 'evil'. And even if he was, he could be have the whole "good guy" persona to get people to trust him, then stab them in the back later. :]

[BronxWench]

I figured it was a given that I'd go for the "Lawful Good" antagonist. That just amuses me no ends!