Reviews and Helping Advance Your Writing

[Tcr]

First, as a writer and prospective published author (hopefully), the first and foremost reason why reviews matter, why any feedback matters, is a simple one.  By receiving feedback from people, it allows a writer (hereafter, I will refer to myself) to improve my writing.  Hearing what has been done good, well, best, or excellently allows me to go back through former chapters, whether posted or unposted, and note the points that were liked.  Hearing what has been done badly, or that someone doesn’t like permits me to go through and note those parts and make changes through the prose and/or character development (if I feel the character development benefits from such changes). 

 

By extent, in doing that, it also allows me to advance through the writing for later chapters.  For example, Pippychick, in a review, made a suggestion and point.  I have consequently gone back through many of the chapters I have already done and reworked them through her suggestion.  Some things work, some things not so much, but this is still advancement.

 

For me, in an original fandom, this is doubly important.  Creating a world, a new world, whether it be based in reality, or science fiction, or fantasy is hard and feedback allows the author know how well they have established that world.  The feedback can help the author create that world more realistically and tangible to them.  The author can, thus, work to create a better experience.

 

Second, also as a writer, a review lifts spirits and feeds the artistic muse.  I have known a few people, and myself, who have been down in the motivation and inspiration reserves.  The will and want to write are drained, the ideas stop coming, and you feel like your attempts to create a world that can be enjoyed are all for nought.  Then, from the blackness of endless self doubt, a review pops up.  Even something as simple as ‘This is great’ or ‘I like this’ can be enough to improve the mood of someone who is in such a slump.  I have seen it happen.  Those words, simple enough, mean a world to an author. 

 

Even if someone does not like the tale, as long as there is a valid criticism, I do not mind hearing it.  I do not know about anyone else on here, but, if someone does not like it, then an explanation of what you did not like.  I cannot speak for anyone else, but constructive criticism helps.  If the characters seem bland or the setting is not working or the plot seems too convoluted, a comment that says: “While I enjoyed the setting, the characters interactions seemed a little too stiff and robotic.  If I may make a suggestion, I noticed that the conversation, for instance, seemed more so.  (Offer a suggestion; perhaps it’s wording, perhaps its the prose and the tags behind it...)”  Like I said, I cannot speak for everyone....  As always, an author has to take reviews and concrit with some grains of salt included...  Some, apparently, with some truckloads.

 

Thirdly, and this is a personal one for me.  I cannot begin to doubt that there are not more people out there who are the same, but...

 

It took a lot for me to come on here.  You can ask my beta that and I’m sure CloverReef will tell you it took a MASSIVE amount of convincing to get me here.  I don’t show my work off to people.  My writing was a closely guarded secret.  Despite what I’m sure some people have seen on here, I am extremely introverted in reality and the idea of doing anything, even making this post, is enough to set off all kinds of anxiety coursing through the veins.  Indeed, it took a while before I even allowed her to read one of mine because I was terrified of the idea that someone else would read that.  Receiving a review, while met with angst and apprehension, shows that there is an appreciation (not just for my own, but for others’ as well) for those who have written out and taken their time to entertain without pay.  A lighthouse amidst a torrent sea; a ray of light in the darkness of night.

 

This being said, receiving concrit is not the same as being a complete fucking asshole.  I’m sure everyone here can think of something to say that does not include the words ‘This sucks’ or ‘Get a life’ or anything else that is merely intended to be insulting.  I will never understand why people feel the need to troll and otherwise being a complete fucking asshole to people.  IF you absolutely hate something to the point you have nothing to say, then please, don’t, people.  Doing that only serves to discourage and otherwise hurt and, if my understanding is right, get you banned.

 

Now that I’ve carried on like a stranger, weird, creepy....weirdo...  Anyone else’s opinions, thoughts on the matter?  Thoughts on how reviews have help improve your abilities?  Why they’re important to you?

[Desiderius Price]

Think you summed it up pretty well.

Given the effort that it can take to bring a fic from an idea to prose, the question of is-it-worth-it is there.  A review lets the author know that it is being read, and (hopefully) enjoyed. 

Like you said, I too, am rather introverted, and it took a lot of courage to even start posting, as it feels like I’m posting naked selfies even though they’re just words.  And I’ve since found that posting has helped me fill in the missing gaps, forcing me to *finish* the stories, and that’s also been enjoyable. 

But in the end, the review is gold currency around here.

- DP

[BronxWench]

Personally speaking, I adore reviews. I love hearing what people liked, what might not have worked quite as well as I’d hoped, and even some solid advice on how I could do better. Concrit is very welcome as well, because I know I’m not perfect, and I want to get better. Obviously, here at AFF, it’s the only currency by which we get paid for sharing our stories. Some people don’t review because they don’t know what to say, but honestly, even a quick, “Loved this chapter!” or “Oh, he did NOT do that! I can’t wait to see what happens now!” can just light up an author’s day.

I’d like to point out that even published authors need reviews, too. Unless you’re a NYT bestseller (and even then, sometimes) reviews are what help build sales. People read reviews, and may decide, based on those reviews, to buy a book. It’s understandable. We’re asking people to part with hard-earned money, and we know they want to be sure it’s money well spent. For indie authors, and authors published by small presses, it’s crucial to even being seen in the wilds of places like Amazon. So, if you buy a book and liked it, leave the author a review on Amazon, or Goodreads, or Facebook. Tweet about it. Blog about it. Share your thoughts and opinions, and help an author out.

And as a moderator, I can’t stress enough that reviews should be about the story, and not the author. If you dislike a story, and can express your thoughts in an adult, coherent manner, that’s fine. A review that says nothing more than “This sucks!” isn’t very helpful, and while it’s not a flame or troll review, it’s certainly a poor reflection on the reviewer. But when you attack an author, that’s flaming, and yes, we WILL remove reviews like that and we WILL ban you. If you encourage others to join in, you’re a troll, as is anyone who jumps on the bandwagon, and I take great pleasure in seeing trolls banned. No one likes an asshole.

[Desiderius Price]

4 minutes ago, BronxWench said:

…. No one likes an asshole.

Ah, so, you’re not into [anal]? 

Yeah, there’s definitely a difference between criticism and attacks, clit is fine.  Genre plays a big role in how fast those reviews come in.   While I’d be floored with one with constructive help, and a full book report, a simple “Hey, I like this”, is chicken soup for the muse.

- DP

[BronxWench]

::snerk:: Yeah, I should phrase that better. How about, “No one likes a shitgibbon.”

 

[Tcr]

11 minutes ago, BronxWench said:

Some people don’t review because they don’t know what to say, but honestly, even a quick, “Loved this chapter!” or “Oh, he did NOT do that! I can’t wait to see what happens now!” can just light up an author’s day.

I know that I always hesitate to leave a review, always worried about how someone is going to take that, and kind of worried that it’s going to be taken the wrong way.  (That’s probably the introvert and questionable side of me rearing its darker side...)…  But, definitely, just a simple statement like those brightens the day drastically. 

 

3 minutes ago, Desiderius Price said:

While I’d be floored with one with constructive help, and a full book report, a simple “Hey, I like this”, is chicken soup for the muse.

lol.  A book report works quite well too.

 

[Tcr]

3 minutes ago, BronxWench said:

::snerk:: Yeah, I should phrase that better. How about, “No one likes a shitgibbon.”

 

lol.  That may work a little better…  But I’m sure someone might… 

[pippychick]

Oh, I agree, reviews are wonderful!

When I stop to think about it, I enjoy the process of writing so much and so often that reviews reassure me I’m not being merely self-indulgent. Even though, truth be told, I’d be quite happy to be self-indulgent. But when someone wants to know what happens next, or discusses the story with others, it’s a great feeling.

But, I think I’ve said before my favourite reviews are those where I get to see the reader’s reaction, and they tell me how reading made them feel. Maybe it’s silly, but especially the darker fiction I’ve written seems to have a life of its own away from my keyboard. I’ve had reviews (and private emails) for some of my work that make me realise I’ve left an impression on someone forever, and that feels better than good. It feels like the creative process really worked in that instance, for that one person, and it’s bigger than me. Those reviews aren’t left for me, they’re left for the story.

If I ever made you frightened, or made you cry. If I broke your heart, or healed it. If I made you laugh, or even take yourself off in private… these are things that have no price. They mean that my stories will probably outlive me, obscure as they are. What happened once will happen again and again. I couldn’t ask for more than that.

In these times, creative writing seems more important than ever, especially in a community like this one, where it isn’t done for monetary gain. Maybe it’s just that I’m getting on, but more and more people seem to delight in showing others how ugly their soul is these days. Everyone seems determined not to care about anything or anyone. I don’t need to point at those people. You all know who they are. Even the darkest things you write are never ugly. They might be frightening, monstrous, brutal, violent and painful, but they aren’t ugly like that. They are all part of the same thing, after all. If you can make someone feel something, anything, you’re a success. No matter how many (or how few) reviews you recieve.

Like others have said, I’m quite introverted too. I don’t know if that means anything. Certainly, it makes us more inclined to reflection, and I think that is quite important if you want to write well.

[CloverReef]

1 hour ago, pippychick said:

If I ever made you frightened, or made you cry. If I broke your heart, or healed it. If I made you laugh, or even take yourself off in private… these are things that have no price. They mean that my stories will probably outlive me, obscure as they are. What happened once will happen again and again. I couldn’t ask for more than that.

Pippy, Everything you said was so friggin apt. Every single word. If I tried to add to this discussion I’d probably just be repeating your points lol. 

So I’ll just say ‘Shitgibbon’, because that’s a word that needs repeating. Thank you for that btw BW. 

[Tcr]

11 hours ago, pippychick said:

When I stop to think about it, I enjoy the process of writing so much and so often that reviews reassure me I’m not being merely self-indulgent. Even though, truth be told, I’d be quite happy to be self-indulgent. But when someone wants to know what happens next, or discusses the story with others, it’s a great feeling.

I’m agreeing wholeheartedly with your entire post as I stare at my own self-indulgent worlds of creation.  I don’t even try to convince myself otherwise, I just keep devouring the words.  At least this isn’t a whole world of chocolate… 

Edited February 9, 2017 by Tcr

[CL Mustafic]

Yeah, so everyone pretty much covered everything about how much a review means to authors so I’ll just second that.

It takes courage to put your words out there, and even after all this time, I still apologize for every chapter I post. Like just the fact that it’s out there is a crime and I’m sorry someone wasted their time reading it which means it’s always surprising when someone takes the time to actually review.

But one thing on negative reviews, even the – this sucks variety. It’s taken me a long time to realize that no matter how hard you try, no story will be universally loved by all, so you have to have thick skin and be able to take the bad with the good if you are going to take that step and let other people read your story. I’m not saying that the people who leave those sorts of reviews aren’t Shitgibbons (that’s the term we’re using now, right?) just that they have an opinion and are free to express it. The nice thing about AFF is you can always rant in a reply thread in response to those sorts of things which I’ve heard is frowned upon when it’s done by published authors.

At the end of the day, you either decide that you are writing for reviews (in which case you are going to end up disappointed in most cases) or you’re writing because it’s something you enjoy doing even without people singing your praises. That being said, I love reviews just like anyone else because I’m a writer and nothing makes a writer’s day like hearing that someone likes their story.

CL

[pippychick]

54 minutes ago, CL Mustafic said:

Like just the fact that it’s out there is a crime and I’m sorry someone wasted their time reading it...

I’m a writer, and so wasting time comes with the hobby, but the time I’ve spent reading your stories was never wasted. For the record, for me Backdoor Politics, the whole Kamal/Zijad thing was one of those perfect things… I’ll remember it forever.   I’m only sorry it had to end.

[BronxWench]

1 hour ago, pippychick said:

I’m a writer, and so wasting time comes with the hobby, but the time I’ve spent reading your stories was never wasted. For the record, for me Backdoor Politics, the whole Kamal/Zijad thing was one of those perfect things… I’ll remember it forever.   I’m only sorry it had to end.

I felt the same way, CL. I could not stop reading that story, and I hated seeing it end. It certainly wasn’t anything resembling a happy ending, but it worked for the characters, and it worked for me. I’m so buying that when it’s released.

[CL Mustafic]

10 hours ago, BronxWench said:

I felt the same way, CL. I could not stop reading that story, and I hated seeing it end. It certainly wasn’t anything resembling a happy ending, but it worked for the characters, and it worked for me. I’m so buying that when it’s released.

You and Pippychick are too kind.  But seriously, I think the lack of confidence runs high in most writers and it’s a huge hurdle to overcome. Reviewers who tell you that you suck and nothing more, are most likely not writers themselves or they’d realize how deep something like that cuts.

[Desiderius Price]

1 hour ago, CL Mustafic said:

But seriously, I think the lack of confidence runs high in most writers and it’s a huge hurdle to overcome. Reviewers who tell you that you suck and nothing more, are most likely not writers themselves or they’d realize how deep something like that cuts.

Yep, I had that same lack of confidence, still do, to a degree.  I was very shaky with that first chapter I had posted, very shaky on the nerves.  While I’m better, still am.

[Tcr]

2 hours ago, Desiderius Price said:

Yep, I had that same lack of confidence, still do, to a degree.  I was very shaky with that first chapter I had posted, very shaky on the nerves.  While I’m better, still am.

I had a severe apprehension of joining.  You can ask CR, she'll tell you...  Lol.  It took a good year of suggestions before I considered and another before I went ahead.  Even then it was a 'do it now or you're not going to!'  Then six months to post on the archive...  That first time, I must have deleted and backed out a dozen times...  Second chapter, while not as much, still had the hesitation...  Now it's a good half hour of staring at it, with worried looks, before hitting the post button…

The forums are almost as bad for me...  I often rethink and delete everything to rewrite essentially the same thing.  (Weird, I know.)  It's a struggle with the demons and half the time that bloody angel's sleeping! 

[BronxWench]

Posting here is hard.

Sending the email with a manuscript attached is agony, and then I spend two weeks looking for the rejection email before I promise myself not to look every ten minutes. And if I do get an email from whoever I sent the manuscript to, it takes me five minutes to click on it to read it. It’s not gotten better, either. I still shake like a leaf every time I hit the send button.

[pippychick]

5 minutes ago, Tcr said:

The forums are almost as bad for me...  I often rethink and delete everything to rewrite essentially the same thing.  (Weird, I know.)  It's a struggle with the demons and half the time that bloody angel's sleeping! 

Oh, I really wouldn’t worry. Just as in RL, the people whose good opinion you’re worried about are far too busy deleting and editing their own forum posts while worrying what you think… I guarantee it *g*

[pippychick]

7 minutes ago, BronxWench said:

I still shake like a leaf every time I hit the send button.

Damn…. :/

*hugs Bronx*

*hugs tcr*

*hugs everyone in the world except for Jeremy Hunt and the orange thing*

And now I’m off to bed for a bit.

[CL Mustafic]

3 hours ago, BronxWench said:

Posting here is hard.

Sending the email with a manuscript attached is agony, and then I spend two weeks looking for the rejection email before I promise myself not to look every ten minutes. And if I do get an email from whoever I sent the manuscript to, it takes me five minutes to click on it to read it. It’s not gotten better, either. I still shake like a leaf every time I hit the send button.

I think I’ve become immune to rejection. I just expect it now so it hurts less. But, man, yeah, hitting the send button is the worst, no, waiting is the worst, no, getting the rejection is the worst, no, it all sucks. Tell me why we do this again?

 (And I’m lying, it totally hurts and I weep inconsolably for at least two full days after each one. )

[pippychick]

40 minutes ago, CL Mustafic said:

And I’m lying, it totally hurts and I weep inconsolably for at least two full days after each one.

*sighs*

*hugs CL too*

I think I’m going to stick to fanfiction.

[BronxWench]

2 hours ago, pippychick said:

*sighs*

*hugs CL too*

I think I’m going to stick to fanfiction.

No, no, because when you don’t get that rejection, when they say, “Yes!”… it’s like nothing else in the world.

[Tcr]

8 minutes ago, BronxWench said:

No, no, because when you don’t get that rejection, when they say, “Yes!”… it’s like nothing else in the world.

Now, if only I could muster up the courage to even try to send mine in…   .  It’s kind of one reason why I joined, too.  Figured if I could get myself posting here for others to see and review, assist in it, I could go back over the one I want to get published and set forth in doing that…

[CL Mustafic]

2 hours ago, pippychick said:

*sighs*

*hugs CL too*

I think I’m going to stick to fanfiction.

I will accept the hug but not the you sticking to fanfiction (though I do love your stories).

20 minutes ago, BronxWench said:

No, no, because when you don’t get that rejection, when they say, “Yes!”… it’s like nothing else in the world.

And yeah, I sort of forgot about that, think I almost passed out the first time and I know I cried then too. Mustn’t forget the good.

14 minutes ago, Tcr said:

Now, if only I could muster up the courage to even try to send mine in…   .  It’s kind of one reason why I joined, too.  Figured if I could get myself posting here for others to see and review, assist in it, I could go back over the one I want to get published and set forth in doing that…

Interestingly enough, if I hadn’t come here to AFF I’d have never found the courage to submit to a publisher so you’re on the right track.

[Tcr]

14 minutes ago, CL Mustafic said:

Interestingly enough, if I hadn’t come here to AFF I’d have never found the courage to submit to a publisher so you’re on the right track.

YAY!  Although, I do have CR to thank A LOT for that, too.  It was a lot of CR’s suggestion to come here as a step towards that end goal.  .  I guess it’s just more the daunting idea of trying to get everything set and ready and not knowing and all that singular jazz as well as the apprehension of utter, continual failure that’s stopping me more at this point…  .

17 minutes ago, CL Mustafic said:

And yeah, I sort of forgot about that, think I almost passed out the first time and I know I cried then too. Mustn’t forget the good.

No, can’t forget the good.  Otherwise you do become a hermit in the middle of nowhere staring at the candle, speaking to it, caressing it, telling it you love it forever and ever.  I mean…  No, that wasn’t from personal experience...