Frustration Times 100

[Guest Purple Lizard]

Okay.

First off, I have tried to keep my word, and review the stories I'v read.

And while I have so far, kept to my word, I do forsee a problem.

Some of these stories deal with severly graphic, and in some cases, disturbing content.

I believe in art for arts sake.

I persicute no one for writing or telling stories in what ever manner they wish, and I know it takes alot of courage to write something that is not sociely acceptible. Even yoi,(yeah, I spelled it wrong) or lets call it as it is, gay stories are more acceptible than others.

Yet its still easier to write something that no one will get behind, then it is to fall in line and say you like it.

And I get the roles my be reversed, the writer tells a story, and the reader likes it, but is afraid to post a response because of the content.

Let me give you an example, and don't hate me for this.

Some stories contain rape, to severel degrees. Some of these stories I enjoy, others I have a hard time liking. As a writer, I can't write rape, it just doesn't do it for me creatively, and I certantly don't condone it any way, (and I hope it never happens to me.)

As far as I'm concerned, if you can't get sex on you own, then you proubly should'nt be having any anyway.

Yet I like the stories.

But thats the rub, if you like the story, you may be dis-enclined to review it positively, out of fear of persicution, or flames, or what ever else that they can throw at you.

And it doesn't end with rape, look at some of the stories; minor, incest, domination, humiliation, torture, death, I'm not sure, but I believe necromancy.

Some of these taboo's are even taboo for the perverse.

It makes it hard for a person to stand up and say, "Hey, I likes this!" when the subject is........darker.

I am also aware that is not always true, I'v noticed that some of the extreme AFF's have reviews while other great works do not. Its an unfair balance. Great story and no reviews, or a one shot of shock, and they bleed out of the wood work.

I dunno....

.

..

...

....

I guess in closing, all I can say, is; Those of us with the balls to say what we like, should own up to it. And those of us who write, should remember that we write because we enjoy it, and damn the rest of them.

Art for arts sake.

[Ryder]

I guess in closing, all I can say, is; Those of us with the balls to say what we like, should own up to it. And those of us who write, should remember that we write because we enjoy it, and damn the rest of them.

Art for arts sake.

Damn right!

[crash]

In as much as I would like more feedback for the stories I have posted on AFF, I realize that I'm not going to get what i want. The number of hits I've had does make me feel better, because it tells me somebody's looking at what I've put on their monitors. It does help with the incentive to keep on going. There have been struggles because one story has been going on for two years. Even with long periods between updates, the numbers still go up. That tells me somebody is interested, and that's all I can ask for.

[Petofsuccubus]

Next time you're feeling bad about a lack of reviews, just think to yourself, "You know, in all likelihood, somebody masturbated to my story."

You're welcome.

[Guest Purple Lizard]

Next time you're feeling bad about a lack of reviews, just think to yourself, "You know, in all likelihood, somebody masturbated to my story."

That's just brilliant!

[Danyealle]

Next time you're feeling bad about a lack of reviews, just think to yourself, "You know, in all likelihood, somebody masturbated to my story."

You're welcome.

that is TOO funny! but true...

[MorbidFantasy]

Next time you're feeling bad about a lack of reviews, just think to yourself, "You know, in all likelihood, somebody masturbated to my story."

You're welcome.

Oh that was never a revelation for me XD

[Magi Kavin]

Next time you're feeling bad about a lack of reviews, just think to yourself, "You know, in all likelihood, somebody masturbated to my story."

You're welcome.

Personally, I consider every hit on a story as someone who's masturbated to my stories. So I've managed to get 20,000 faps so far. Woo! That always helps me feel better. ;P

[Guest MiriuOniaya]

~I really liked reading through this thread, it's interesting to read everyone's thoughts! I was a reader long before I ever tried my hand at writing. Looking through users who posted in here, and checking out profiles, I have to say that I wouldn't read stories by the majority of people in here.

But it's because I don't read het. And like many people, I like certain pairings and universes better than others. When browsing I usually look in the M/M sections, and if I'm in a section where it's not seperated, I pass over anything het and purposely look for the slash. I mostly stick to the original fics, and only go elsewhere when I'm in the mood for something different, or something imparticular.

~For me; I completely agree with the new rule against review whoring. It always greatly annoyed me when authors left little notes like that. It made me not want to review, especially when they were very rude about it. So yay AFF for working at stopping this!

~I really love to give reviews, long blabby ones about what I liked. But honestly, it comes and goes and also depends on how much I like the story. Lately, I've only been leaving short ones on stories that I really like. I will say that overly huge paragraphs and poor spelling are turn-offs for me, but I'm usually willing to give anything a try.

~As for getting reviews; who doesn't love them? They make me extremely happy~ But I've never been one to stop updating because of a lack of reviews. As long the hit number is changing every time I update, that's good enough for me. Getting reviews are a bonus.

Edited March 19, 2010 by MiriuOniaya

[canterro]

I think there are two main groups of writers. Oh, well, maybe three:

1. Those who write just for pure pleasure of writing. It's their way to give a vent to their fantasy. And maybe a good idea to please reader who like it.

They don't treat writing as a hard work, they just have fun. For them reviews are nice (for whom they don't?) but not necessary.

2. Those who write 'seriously'. They put a lot of effort to master their works and aim for the title of a good writer. They try to learn, to develop their skills, and reviews are the base they build on. For them reviews are like showing directions: this you do wonderfully, this I like, this is boring, and in this part I don't understand what's going on...

Those writers take all concrete reviews and try to learn from them. That's why I, for example NEED reviews. Not only for satisfaction, but mainly for education.

3. Those who think they are great and don't need anyone to confirm that, or, God forbid, to criticize. They always know better and if they don't get reviews, they think "To hell with them. They don't even recognize the fine art..." ;P

[RogueMudblood]

Well, that was ... informative and comical. And I thought, as a non-writing reader, I'd put in my two cents, as it were.

Why I don't (always) review a fic I'm reading:

1) It's finished, you don't intend to change it, any critique I offer is going to be poorly received at this point. (This is true, I've got several examples from over on FFNet - did you know you could flame a review? Why, yes, Obi-Wan, you can.)

2) "Concrit welcome" - No, it's not. Even if all I have to say is "I like your story, truly I do. I would be better able to understand parts of it, though, if there were more formal punctuation." (and I give examples from the text "as is" and "corrected") I get back "What are you, some kind of comma nazi?" And some very negative commentary that follows that statement that I don't feel the need to share. No matter how much other positive review I left.

3) Review whores do make me mad, and turn me off. Even if your story had me hot and bothered until then, at that point, not only have you just killed my buzz, you've also made me want to stop reading your story - I don't care *how* good it is.

4) It's a WIP, you're not a review whore, and the only thing I could possibly say is "good work"... And I really couldn't expand on it to tell you *what* I thought was good about it. Some of you seem to think it would be a good ego booster, and maybe it would be. I try to leave more substantive reviews when I do leave one, however.

5) I'm blissed out on the orgasm I just had, thank you very much, and I don't type when I'm blissed out.

There are other reasons, but those are the main (somewhat positive) reasons I could give. Because I have received such negative response to any substantial critique I've given, I don't bother. Why should I? I'm here to be entertained. I'll try to help you be better at it, if you want, but since the response I get to "Let me help you entertain me better" is "F* off b*!" why should I critique anything?

So, I leave a line in my profile that seems to sum it up best: "I say what I mean. And sometimes it's cruel." Because, for the majority of authors (maybe not the ones posting on this board, but they are out there), anything more than "good job" is cruel. And I refuse to leave a "good work, post soon" review.

There you have it, ladies and gentlemen, for what it's worth to you. I'm probably not the only reader out there who has experienced review-flaming (I never thought about it before it happened and my god was it a shock) who no longer leaves reviews on things that could truly be improved. Although, I will say that reason number five is a predominate reason on this site.

[marley_station]

Well, that was ... informative and comical. And I thought, as a non-writing reader, I'd put in my two cents, as it were.

Why I don't (always) review a fic I'm reading:

1) It's finished, you don't intend to change it, any critique I offer is going to be poorly received at this point. (This is true, I've got several examples from over on FFNet - did you know you could flame a review? Why, yes, Obi-Wan, you can.)

2) "Concrit welcome" - No, it's not. Even if all I have to say is "I like your story, truly I do. I would be better able to understand parts of it, though, if there were more formal punctuation." (and I give examples from the text "as is" and "corrected") I get back "What are you, some kind of comma nazi?" And some very negative commentary that follows that statement that I don't feel the need to share. No matter how much other positive review I left.

3) Review whores do make me mad, and turn me off. Even if your story had me hot and bothered until then, at that point, not only have you just killed my buzz, you've also made me want to stop reading your story - I don't care *how* good it is.

4) It's a WIP, you're not a review whore, and the only thing I could possibly say is "good work"... And I really couldn't expand on it to tell you *what* I thought was good about it. Some of you seem to think it would be a good ego booster, and maybe it would be. I try to leave more substantive reviews when I do leave one, however.

5) I'm blissed out on the orgasm I just had, thank you very much, and I don't type when I'm blissed out.

There are other reasons, but those are the main (somewhat positive) reasons I could give. Because I have received such negative response to any substantial critique I've given, I don't bother. Why should I? I'm here to be entertained. I'll try to help you be better at it, if you want, but since the response I get to "Let me help you entertain me better" is "F* off b*!" why should I critique anything?

So, I leave a line in my profile that seems to sum it up best: "I say what I mean. And sometimes it's cruel." Because, for the majority of authors (maybe not the ones posting on this board, but they are out there), anything more than "good job" is cruel. And I refuse to leave a "good work, post soon" review.

There you have it, ladies and gentlemen, for what it's worth to you. I'm probably not the only reader out there who has experienced review-flaming (I never thought about it before it happened and my god was it a shock) who no longer leaves reviews on things that could truly be improved. Although, I will say that reason number five is a predominate reason on this site.

Your candor is refreshing...and entertaining.

[gtaylor0406]

I totally understand. I do review if the story is good or not.

[Tempestuous]

It's kind of a double-edged sword to provide constructive crit. In the end it comes down to whether or not the author takes it personally. I myself never take constructive crit personally, since I don't really base any characters or stories on me unless I would specifically write a non-fic, so I treat it as something I'll need to fix and keep in mind for the future.

But then there's those who go absolutely insane over it and call you a flamer who has no life, and even hunt down your stories to review them and call them stupid and worthless - well, you know how it goes.

Nobody really likes criticism, but if it helps them move forward, they can learn to like it.

Nevertheless, I tip my hat to anyone who reviews frequently with constructive criticism. Not everybody will appreciate it, but there's always those who will be grateful for it.

[cowgirl65]

The main site for fanfic in my fandom is full of people who review. It's not uncommon to get 9 or more reviews per chapter posted and it's a marvelous ego boost, I can tell you.

I haven't gotten any reviews for stories on AFF yet, but I can tell you, every + rating (1 or 5, doesn't matter) on this board means so much more, just because I know someone has liked or disliked it that much to even rate it.

Comments are like ambrosia, but even a quick rating says a lot of what readers think, even if not why.

[GinnyM.Potter]

I'm scared mostly to post a story because i am my worst critic. When i post a story, like i just did, its hard for me to see the feedback but yet i want it at the same time. I just posted one for Michael Jackson and i really want the feedback to be about the story itself and not the man its written about. Hopefully you will keep that in mind when you post your reviews. I hope you read it though.

[hustlerose]

Well, that was ... informative and comical. And I thought, as a non-writing reader, I'd put in my two cents, as it were.

Why I don't (always) review a fic I'm reading:

1) It's finished, you don't intend to change it, any critique I offer is going to be poorly received at this point. (This is true, I've got several examples from over on FFNet - did you know you could flame a review? Why, yes, Obi-Wan, you can.)

2) "Concrit welcome" - No, it's not. Even if all I have to say is "I like your story, truly I do. I would be better able to understand parts of it, though, if there were more formal punctuation." (and I give examples from the text "as is" and "corrected") I get back "What are you, some kind of comma nazi?" And some very negative commentary that follows that statement that I don't feel the need to share. No matter how much other positive review I left.

3) Review whores do make me mad, and turn me off. Even if your story had me hot and bothered until then, at that point, not only have you just killed my buzz, you've also made me want to stop reading your story - I don't care *how* good it is.

4) It's a WIP, you're not a review whore, and the only thing I could possibly say is "good work"... And I really couldn't expand on it to tell you *what* I thought was good about it. Some of you seem to think it would be a good ego booster, and maybe it would be. I try to leave more substantive reviews when I do leave one, however.

5) I'm blissed out on the orgasm I just had, thank you very much, and I don't type when I'm blissed out.

There are other reasons, but those are the main (somewhat positive) reasons I could give. Because I have received such negative response to any substantial critique I've given, I don't bother. Why should I? I'm here to be entertained. I'll try to help you be better at it, if you want, but since the response I get to "Let me help you entertain me better" is "F* off b*!" why should I critique anything?

So, I leave a line in my profile that seems to sum it up best: "I say what I mean. And sometimes it's cruel." Because, for the majority of authors (maybe not the ones posting on this board, but they are out there), anything more than "good job" is cruel. And I refuse to leave a "good work, post soon" review.

There you have it, ladies and gentlemen, for what it's worth to you. I'm probably not the only reader out there who has experienced review-flaming (I never thought about it before it happened and my god was it a shock) who no longer leaves reviews on things that could truly be improved. Although, I will say that reason number five is a predominate reason on this site.

loling oh man. I had to register just so I could tell you these three words:

I love you.

[W.D.Lady]

I used to feel the same way, so don't feel bad if you consider yourself the only one. I got so bad to the point that I would actually delete my stories and get depressed if I didn't get any reviews or enough reviews. As writers, whether it be fan fiction or original stories, we are clearly sensitive to people's thoughts/opinions of rejection and even we crave some kind of recognition... even if it's good or bad.

When I was younger, my stories were my babies in a sense, and I didn't know any better. I was very sensitive to people's thoughts and opinions… I still am a little bit because I am somewhat fearful of rejection since I often write controversial issues. If you're going to be a writer, you must ask yourself why do I want to be a writer? It's not because of the fame, the glory, or the recognition. You shouldn't write if you think you're going to be the next Stephen King or the next Stephanie Meyer with the "Twilight Series," and make $1 million dollars and have a hit movie with billions of fans.

I went through that type of phase as well, thinking that if my stories were really that good I'd get like 100 and something reviews, right? WRONG! Stop thinking that way because it's not going to happen... YOU MUST write for the most important person and that's YOU. You could be the greatest writer in the entire world and still get only one review or maybe none whatsoever. Do you really want to finish your story because someone told you your story was great? You're basing your motivation and writing goals over what other people think and determine for you.

You have to write because you want to write! You do it for yourself. You should have a passion to write, even when people tell you to stop. You shouldn't care what other people think, regardless if they comment or not. Feedback is still appreciated sometimes; however, write for you and only you! Get motivated and get satisfaction from finishing your story. If you really think your story is bad, have a Beta reader read it for you so they can give you honest, and constructive criticism.

Anyway, that's all I have to say and good luck.

[Karategirl422]

I used to feel the same way, so don't feel bad if you consider yourself the only one. I got so bad to the point that I would actually delete my stories and get depressed if I didn't get any reviews or enough reviews. As writers, whether it be fan fiction or original stories, we are clearly sensitive to people's thoughts/opinions of rejection and even we crave some kind of recognition... even if it's good or bad.

When I was younger, my stories were my babies in a sense, and I didn't know any better. I was very sensitive to people's thoughts and opinions… I still am a little bit because I am somewhat fearful of rejection since I often write controversial issues. If you're going to be a writer, you must ask yourself why do I want to be a writer? It's not because of the fame, the glory, or the recognition. You shouldn't write if you think you're going to be the next Stephen King or the next Stephanie Meyer with the "Twilight Series," and make $1 million dollars and have a hit movie with billions of fans.

I went through that type of phase as well, thinking that if my stories were really that good I'd get like 100 and something reviews, right? WRONG! Stop thinking that way because it's not going to happen... YOU MUST write for the most important person and that's YOU. You could be the greatest writer in the entire world and still get only one review or maybe none whatsoever. Do you really want to finish your story because someone told you your story was great? You're basing your motivation and writing goals over what other people think and determine for you.

You have to write because you want to write! You do it for yourself. You should have a passion to write, even when people tell you to stop. You shouldn't care what other people think, regardless if they comment or not. Feedback is still appreciated sometimes; however, write for you and only you! Get motivated and get satisfaction from finishing your story. If you really think your story is bad, have a Beta reader read it for you so they can give you honest, and constructive criticism.

Anyway, that's all I have to say and good luck.

Love this! Very well said and great advice! Writing for the fun of it and for yourself is most important, never lose sight of that by getting hung up on reviews or rates.

[W.D.Lady]

Love this! Very well said and great advice! Writing for the fun of it and for yourself is most important, never lose sight of that by getting hung up on reviews or rates.

EXACTLY! (gives you a high-five)

[Rain7777]

I thought this was a great thread to read through. It was interesting to get an insight into other people's thoughts and opinions on, not only reviewing but the whole writer vs reader element.

I admit before I started really getting into writing my reviews were short. Even now when I do review, (Not so much anymore but only because I have had no time to read fics because I've been working on my own,) I tend to put only the positive. I will mention the elements that I really enjoyed like if I think they kept the characters true to the original. Or if I felt a certain chapter was really emotive. Sometimes it was just a matter of OMFG that was hot!!!

I agree with everyone when they say they want to here feedback. If things have gone quiet on my fic for a while I often just message to ask if its because of anything inparticular. Or I put in that I am concerned that having taken a certain route with the fic has put people off. I've then had readers message and say I don't like where you took it, I liked it up till now but I won't be reading anymore. To which I thank them because they've been loyal to the story, its not to their tastes, which is nothing personal to me so I'm just thankful that they took the time to tell me.

Even this morning I got a critical email from someone about punctuation and how thoughts and other issues were written and I will admit at first I was filled with dread going oh god I KNEW I was terrible. But I took what they had to say and I took into account that this reader had messaged me in order to help me! I messaged back and truly admitted, writing is NOT my forte. I write for fun. BUT I'm glad she told me about the things that were wrong because I am still learning from it.

Any type of review (as long as its not a REAL flame or a troller leaving it) is great with me. Because you have to admit it is great to get even those short ones that are one line saying they liked it because to me, that a reader took their time to leave it sometimes means more than the content of the review.

I must admit I never knew so many readers felt concerned about leaving a review and this makes me really sad. I know that personally I'll remember what some of the readers said and take it into account when I write my next author's note.

BUT each to their own. We all work differently. We all like different things. Some fandoms get more readers and will get more reviews. I wouldn't take it to heart though because the fact that you've put something up on here for others to read is great. I think as writers it takes a certain amount of courage to post. And I often worry what the response will be to a fic because some people can be horrible about it and flame but at the end of the day just because one person didn't like it it shouldn't put you off writing. At the end of the day if its good crit it may improve your fic and that's great don't you think? As writers we really should want to do our best (although I also understand that some people write solely for fun and not to improve their writing.) If it's a negative review or one you don't take kindly to, ignore it. Just because one person didn't like it it doesn't mean others don't enjoy reading it.

I'm glad this thread got posted because hopefully the writers have taken things into account as well as the readers. I certainly have. I always leave a small message saying: I hope you liked it, please review. But if people think that may be a turn off for readers I'm going to stop doing it. I also hope that readers took into account that most of us don't mind critical reviews though it is nice if they are written with tact. I hope that readers will now feel more welcome to leave bigger reviews. I know that I for one will take into account everything that was written in this thread because it gave a lot of people's insight-which is what this is all about really.

Sorry for the rant. And oh how I laughed about Magi Kavin with the 1 hit is equal to one fap! lol! I am slightly worried now that i've caused over 40,000 faps! I hope not too many of those were the same person! hehehe!

(I also really liked Dannyealle wrote from her blog. Very informative )

[RogueMudblood]

I must admit I never knew so many readers felt concerned about leaving a review and this makes me really sad. I know that personally I'll remember what some of the readers said and take it into account when I write my next author's note.

I don't say what I say to make anyone sad

I say it to help explain why a lot of readers (myself included) will pass up reviewing a fic.

I always leave a small message saying: I hope you liked it, please review. But if people think that may be a turn off for readers I'm going to stop doing it.

That's not a turn-off. That's not even whoring. Requests (which is what that is) are perfectly fine. Whoring is this: "I'm not going to post another chapter until I have XX reviews." At which point, I'm completely turned off the fic because the author's decided it's not fun to write, it's a chore. If they don't receive quantifiable validation of their efforts they aren't going to spend their time on it. So if it's not worth your time to finish the fic, it's not worth my time to read an unfinished work. One that I know will remain unfinished, because eventually even loyal readers become irate at an author's demands.

What you've done is fine. "Tell me how I'm doing" is imminently acceptable - I just tend not to because people don't like to hear that angels don't sing from where the sun doesn't shine. Most fics I read, authors are afraid of . I'm more inclined to leave :clap: when the author indicates they actually care about their work. (I just haven't gotten to reading yours yet. You are on my list of fics to get to. It's a long list.)

[Rain7777]

I don't say what I say to make anyone sad

I say it to help explain why a lot of readers (myself included) will pass up reviewing a fic.

That's not a turn-off. That's not even whoring. Requests (which is what that is) are perfectly fine. Whoring is this: "I'm not going to post another chapter until I have XX reviews." At which point, I'm completely turned off the fic because the author's decided it's not fun to write, it's a chore. If they don't receive quantifiable validation of their efforts they aren't going to spend their time on it. So if it's not worth your time to finish the fic, it's not worth my time to read an unfinished work. One that I know will remain unfinished, because eventually even loyal readers become irate at an author's demands.

What you've done is fine. "Tell me how I'm doing" is imminently acceptable - I just tend to not because people don't like to hear that angels don't sing from where the sun doesn't shine. Most fics I read, authors are afraid of . I'm more inclined to leave :clap: when the author indicates they actually care about their work. (I just haven't gotten to reading yours yet. You are on my list of fics to get to. It's a long list.)

Haha! No worries about reading it or not. I'm just happy writing it. I'm ill and can't work so it really keeps me occupied. It's why it means even more to me to have gotten reviews because I'm soooo tired at the end of the day I know there are going to be mistakes. But if someone points them out to me I've learnt to say thanks and correct it because its human nature to make a mistake and any corrections I make can only help to make it better.

Thanks for getting back to me and clearing up the matter on whether or not it was ok to ask for feedback like that. i've never said, no more fic unless I see more reviews because I feel that isn't why I'm writing. Reviews are just an extra bonus. I can understand to a certain extent why people would write that but I totally understand the turn off it would be to the reader.

I'm really glad you, and everyone else on here were honest about it all. I feel this thread really helped me as both a reader and writer, to take on board the different issues to do with leaving reviews

[Karategirl422]

EXACTLY! (gives you a high-five)

(Gives high-five back!) :clap:

lol Great topic with great advice.

[FairySlayer]

All of you are so right.

When I started writing fanfic I craved reviews more than anything. Now I think I got into erotic fanfiction only because it was, or seemed like, an easy way to get more attention. "Unfortunately" I started writing more plot-driven stories and the folks on the other sites didn't pay attention anymore. I mostly stopped writing for a long time because the plethora of "Dick in Jane" stories seemed to get a lot of feedback while mine were barely noticed.

Now I've learned to write what I want and do it mostly for myself (and, yes, a recent request by a long-time friend). It's much easier for me to sit down with a notepad or in front of the screen and say to myself, "What will be good?" instead of, "What will make people like me?"

But of course, I'm always interested in what I could do better.

Thanks for sharing, everyone. Now I feel even better.

Edited July 24, 2010 by FairySlayer