The story I'm posting has been hidden despite having a proper disclaimer.

[Guest Snowqueen Icedragon]

I looked up how to write a disclaimer properly, and followed the instructions to the letter. However, I have discovered this in place of the story:

"This story is hidden until it has been confirmed to meet the conditions of the site.

Most likely, that means you lack a proper disclaimer.

Please contact site admin to find out why it was hidden if your disclaimers include all required parts."

Please rectify this error. Thank you.

[Guest Snowqueen Icedragon]

Here's the link:

http://books.adult-fanfiction.org/story.php?no=600095095

[Guest Snowqueen Icedragon]

Furthermore, I made formatting corrections to the chapters as they were uploaded. I can no longer access them. I require access to the chapters. Thank you.

[DemonGoddess]

As this story is now published, by E.L. James, under the title 50 Shades of Grey; and this was/is her old fanfiction pen name, you'll need to prove that you are, in fact, her. We cannot allow a user to pose as another, whether or not the old pen name is being used by that author anymore.

[Guest Snowqueen Icedragon]

Her user name was "Snowqueens Icedragon." Mine is "Snowqueen Icedragon." And in the very disclaimer the story was 'hidden' for, it said that I am NOT her. I have NOT posed as her. Here is the disclaimer I used: "I do not own Twilight or any element of its fandom. Because I am not EL James, I am not making any money from this public-doman fanwork."

She and her publisher claim the story is not 50 Shades. She and her publisher say the two stories are distinct. Because Master of the Universe has already been published, it is a separate story and is public domain. I am posting it so that the public may have access to it as per their personal interests. I do not see why anyone here should take issue with this.

[DemonGoddess]

Master of the Universe was published by EL James as a fanfiction. It's still HER original work. You cannot post that here. You cannot attempt to pose as another, as you're obviously doing. Because it started life as fanfiction does not make it automatically public domain.

[Guest Snowqueen Icedragon]

I'm not attempting to pose as another. I said overtly that I'm not EL James. Are you denying the content of my disclaimer? My username references hers. It does not pose as hers. If I wanted to pose as or impersonate her, I would have added the S. I am not a moron.

You say I can't post the work here because it was written by someone else. Could I please have a link or reference to those rules, as already stated at aff.net? I read the rules and didn't see a rule against it. I could have missed it, but I won't believe that I did miss it until I see it. Thank you.

[DemonGoddess]

Terms of Service

You understand that when posting User Submissions, you are stating that any work submitted under your User Account is your own personal work and has not been in any part copied or plagiarized from any source. Furthermore, you understand that you are not to post anyone else's work without the express permission of the original copyright holder unless said work is part of Public Domain.

Fanfiction is allowed to exist because of Fair Use. That does NOT make the fanfiction the authors post whether now, or in the past, public domain.

[Guest Snowqueen Icedragon]

I would also like temporary access to the story at the very least, as I plan to post it elsewhere, and made formatting corrections that I would not like to have to repeat all over again. Reading through this tripe once is more than enough for me.

[Guest Snowqueen Icedragon]

Thank you for the direct ToS reference, as well. You've been helpful, albeit somewhat boneheaded.

[Guest Snowqueen Icedragon]

Hey, I had an idea -- If I change all the characters' names to something else, will you accept that as original work? EL James's publisher did, after all.

Though since keeping a work out of the public domain requires one to be able to copyright it, and copyright can't be applied to fanfiction, I don't see how you can claim that Master of the Universe is not in the public domain in the first place. Are you sure you understand copyright law?

[Guest Snowqueen Icedragon]

Could you please direct me toward your supervisor (or person of equivalent status)?

[Guest Snowqueen Icedragon]

According to the ToS point that you quoted, I AM allowed to post this story. The work IS public domain, as it can't be copyrighted, and I said in the disclaimer itself that I am not EL James. Your arguments have been overturned. As yet, it appears the hiding of the story is what violates the ToS. If you would like me to make it more clear that I am not EL James, I can do that -- at the top of each chapter and in my user bio, for example. I am willing to be accomodating.

[ApolloImperium]

Okay deary - First off, DG is my right hand woman; it is a cold day in hell when her and I aren't on the same page, but you can't get any higher than me - I own the site. Since your ignorance of copyright law is amazing, let us have a little lesson:

Fan Fiction is considered to be a transformative or derivative work which by the US Copyright Act defines as:

A “derivative work” is a work based upon one or more pre-existing works, such as a translation, musical arrangement, dramatization, fictionalization, motion picture version, sound recording, art reproduction, abridgment, condensation, or any other form in which a work may be recast, transformed, or adapted. A work consisting of editorial revisions, annotations, elaborations, or other modifications which, as a whole, represent an original work of authorship, is a “derivative work”.

17 U.S.C. § 103(b) states:

The copyright in a compilation or derivative work extends only to the material contributed by the author of such work, as distinguished from the preexisting material employed in the work, and does not imply any exclusive right in the preexisting material. The copyright in such work is independent of, and does not affect or enlarge the scope, duration, ownership, or subsistence of, any copyright protection in the preexisting material.

They further more defined it further in a later publication (US Copyright Office Circular 14: Derivative Works)

A typical example of a derivative work received for registration in the Copyright Office is one that is primarily a new work but incorporates some previously published material. This previously published material makes the work a derivative work under the copyright law. To be copyrightable, a derivative work must be different enough from the original to be regarded as a "new work" or must contain a substantial amount of new material. Making minor changes or additions of little substance to a preexisting work will not qualify the work as a new version for copyright purposes. The new material must be original and copyrightable in itself. Titles, short phrases, and format, for example, are not copyrightable.

Therefore, a legal case can be made that fan fiction can be copyrighted so long as there is a large amount of new material.

To apply it to this particular instance, EL James used only the character's names and descriptions, creating her own characterizations, settings, plot and world, which can be regarded as a substantial amount of new material.

While to date, there has been no formal testing of this in court to the very end, Salinger v. Colting is an excellent example. While there was initially an injunction from the District Court, the Appellate court reversed the injunction and sent it back down for the 'fair use' and transformative work doctrine to be reapplied. Unfortunately for those of us waiting to see how this would ultimately be determined, the parties settled out of court and it was never fully tested in a court of law.

That being said, Master of the Universe is not public domain and you may not post it (or the same story with names changed) on AFF. The story was a product of her imagination that while she changed names to create a original work, is hers in its entirety - Both versions.

We have removed your posting of the story from our site and it may not be republished.

[DemonGoddess]

In order to access your account, you will need to reset your password

[Guest Snowqueen Icedragon]

Okay, Apollo, you've argued that some fanfiction, including Master of the Universe, could maybe potentially be copyrighted at some point. This is interesting, and thank you for the effort, but you have not demonstrated that it IS coprighted. You can say, "Master of the Universe is not public domain," as many times as you like, but repeating a statement does not make it true. You are still wrong. The writer does NOT hold a copyright to the work, and thus it remains in the public domain. The derivative work was not authorized, so the creator (in this case James) does not hold a copyright to any of it. Whether she could potentially hold it is not relevant at this time.

Read up: http://www.copyright...efinitions.html

"We have removed your posting of the story from our site and it may not be republished."

It will be republished elsewhere.

It would have been nice of you to give me a warning so I could keep the work I did before removing it. Instead, you've chosen to be condescending and then deliberately destructive, without just cause.

Thanks for nothing.

[Guest Snowqueen Icedragon]

Why do I need to reset my password? This experience has been downright tyrranical.

[ApolloImperium]

Copyright is implied and automatically granted even if not implicitly stated to any work from April 1, 1989 forward, please re-read your copyright law. Again, you are incorrect.

[ApolloImperium]

As per the offical website: http://www.copyright...17/92appii.html

Broken down to easy to understand terms: http://www.templeton.../copymyths.html

Heaven forbid the expedient application of our ToS and copyright law be consider tyrannical - Let's go after the gov't - How dare they create copyright law! It's tyrannical I tell you!!

[Guest Snowqueen Icedragon]

Your "easy to understand" link is broken.

Regardless, due to the off-topic and distracting straw man attack in your last sentence, it has become obvious to me that you seek only to villify me and weild your own power without compromize. You won't budge, no matter how wrong I show you to be. It's sad to see someone so enamoured with her own power, but I'm aware I can't do anything about it. This is my final response.

[ApolloImperium]

Actually - I'm not. It's foolish to think that someone who owns and operates the 2nd largest fan fiction website on the internet would be ignorant of copyright laws. Not only have I had discussions with various legal sources, I did my own research prior to consulting with them. Your arguments hold no water.

Please also note, that as you are intent on infringing on EL James' copyright, your information including IP address data has been sent to both her and her editor along with copies of what was posted to this site and our removal of it.

I wish you luck with your faulty arguments if and when they decide to send you a C&D letter

I'd say happy writing, but it is apparent that you much prefer taking someone elses work in it's entirety as opposed to creating something of your own.

[Guest Lawless2]

Okay, I wasn't going to say anything but apparently I just can't help myself.

OMG Woman!

Are you seriously this stupid? Let me give you a bit of legal advice, you may need it in the near future...just as clarification: whomever wrote it gets automatic copyrights to it, if it is substantially different (in the case of fanfic) from the original story. If it is an original story, no contest, author gets copyright. If it is close to the original story (the original author maintains all rights) and if you are posting work written by someone else with just a few minor changes, names, dates, places, etc and the PLOT stays the same it is PLAGIARISM! If you are doing it without their permission.

Public domain is for works that copyright has expired on, not publicly posted, this includes things that were published in say the 17th century not last year. What I'm writing right now is considered copyrighted and it doesn't have to say it is. Basically, if you didn't create it, it isn't yours to post.

Here...maybe you could follow the legal links this provides as well as just read what everyone but you seems to know.

http://en.wikipedia....ith_fan_fiction

The site administrators are not even well within their rights to delete your posting, they are legally obligated! You admit it is not your work...why do you want to post something that isn't yours? Why does it matter so much to you that you "take credit" for someone else's work? If you were able to create your own work, you certainly would not want someone to post it, I'm sure. So why do it to someone else? I understand wanting to be an author but you have nothing to gain other than a liable suit and copyfruad charges. Both of which you are admittedly in this forum guilty of.

Knock it off and go try to write your own E/B story. It's much more satisfying than going to court and looking like a doofus, which is what is going to happen if you aren't careful.

[WillowDarkling]

since Lawless2 doesn't have a like button on his post, I just have to... :clap:

[Guest Lawless2]

LOL not the responses I was expecting but maybe even better. Thanks all!

[LockedBox]

Oh dear god, how can so much stupid exist in one person? Lawless, I couldn't have said it better myself, thankyou!

Apollo, I'd like to apologize on behalf of this self obsessed git. They are obviously hoisted so high up in prima donna land that they can't see the real world below!

If I were in your shoes, I'd hall of shame this self entitled brat and preserve this thread for posterity, I still can't believe that she's for real!

EDIT: What do you know, she's been shamed already, ha! Apollo, you are officially a baddass. I salute you

Edited June 27, 2012 by LockedBox