Allowing Fan Fiction

[Guest Alien Pirate Pixagi]

As Cain and I are working on a TOP SECRET project, working on our own original work which we plan on having professionally published, the question of whether or not to allow fan fiction of said work has arisen. While, indeed, there are some scary ideas that come up in calculated the consequences, we decided that, yes, we would allow, and perhaps even encourage fan fiction of every kind. Indeed, it would be quite hypocritical of us to bar fan fiction from being made, for obvious reasons. Of course, I would NEVER condone people making money from my characters/world (this includes paysites). Also, under some circumstances, when concerning my own work, if it had to do with something from my actual life/something that has a significant meaning to me, then I'd ask that no one make fan fiction from my work.

[EveKnight75]

I write fanfiction and I view fanart and fanvids, so it would be extremely hypocritical of me to not allow the same for any of my fans were I to get published.

In fact, if I were a pro and an interviewer asked me about my opinions regarding fanfiction, I'd admit the fact that I wrote fanfiction but I'd also tell them that I've never published any for profit and I'd never give them my username or tell them which sites I'm on. Then I'd sit back for the wankery to begin. To be fair, I'll jump in and defend my views instead of hiding after stirring the shit.

Imitation is the highest form of flattery. I know that fanworks play a huge role in keeping fans and attracting more fans.

I think that I would have a few conditions.

- I'd want to know where fanwork based on my stuff is being posted. If a site hosts fanwork based off my stuff and failed to inform me after a certain period of time, I'd take action. Go ahead and do whatever fanwork you want - I don't have to like it - but let me know that it exists. (The reason would be because I want to see it all for myself, but I'd never admit it!)

- I wouldn't allow fanwork to be posted online on any profit site. It'd be important to me that no "outsiders" make money off my work. The only exception would be for renditions into another medium, and even then I'd insist on some say in the matter. I've never liked professional fanfiction written merely for profit. If someone else wanted to professionally publish something based off my work, they'd have to convince me that they're not doing it for the money or they'd have to wait until I'm a corpse. I'd probably write something into my will giving copyrights to an honest foundation (I still admire Barrie for that).

Come to think of it, I haven't really thought this through. I do know that I'd allow and encourage fanwork despite the fact that I know I'll end up objecting to a lot of it. Still, I don't think I'd be fully comfortable giving absolute free reign. The control freak in me would insist on being aware of as much as possible, but it wouldn't insist on banning personally objectionable content. And that would be because I have personal experience in the fan realm.

[madlodger]

Well, Pixagi,

After all time, effort and money spent; after finally getting published FOR REAL; do you really want your fans to ran away and write Harry Potter fanfics?

I would have an official Pixagi/Cain website with a very clear statement about my position on fanfics. It would be pretty friendly and permited almost anything with, perhaps, exeption of underaged sex.

EveKnight is right about

- I wouldn't allow fanwork to be posted online on any profit site

However, people can submit quality fiction for AUTHORIZED publishing, which would bring in a per cent of profits. Who knows, maybe it would become more popular than the fic itself and bring in 10 times more dow. How pragmatic.

[CainTheEternal]

I don't believe that it's within our right to prevent people from writing fanfiction, only to prevent them from profiting from such works.

[Keith Inc.]

When we were little, we'd watch a movie, or TV show, and want to go do that.

We searched the woods for the Spindrift, we figured the flight path the Flying Sub would take through the canyon, we drew straws to see who would kneecap Doctor Smith. We'd strap plastic guns in the places James West kept his backup piece. We had decks of cards held together with rubber bands, and a complicated arrangement so that a third of them flipped up so we could call the Enterprise.

We took the ideas of writers and actors and made them our own. We played in their cities, their universe, their futures. We didn't just discuss 'who would win, Darth Vader or Gandalf?" we beat each other bloody with our light sabre/staff.

The urge to play in other people's worlds is, in my mind, central to an active imagination. And a wonderful compliment. I mean, there are those on 90210 that i'd have slept with, but no one i wanted to be.

But i'd sell a kid to serve on any of the Enterprise ships.

I'd encourage FF, personally. If i ever get published. Just not for profit...

[redsliver]

Yes of course I would. Telling someone what they can and cannot write is both censorship and stupid, like telling someone how to think. If someone made money off of my words or worlds, good for them. I'd probably get pissed or bitter by it but I'm an admitted hypocrite. I'm just hocking ideas, and you can't own ideas.

To deny fanfiction is to deny enjoyment of your work, and if you're going to do that what was the point of sharing it in the first place.

In conclusion the only sensible option is to let any and all fan based works develop however your fans want them to.

Edit:

It seems that everyone sees it as evil to profit with fanfiction, why? Honestly, where's the harm? Let's say you sell me a book, are you saying I don't own the book? I'm just renting it? Its goddamned silly to say: "Oh I support fanfiction, I'm not going to censor your words, just your fiscal ambitions."

[Keith Inc.]

YOu own the book, but not the ideas in the book.

You can buy a movie, but it's a separate deal to buy the rights to make a sequel.

[redsliver]

Just because that's what the law says doesn't mean it makes sense. And you can't own ideas, that's silly.

[Keith Inc.]

Just because that's what the law says doesn't mean it makes sense.

But it currently IS the law of the land. If the whole, or a significant portion of, the fanfic community turned to making profit off other people's copyrighted works, then the lawyers will start circling like sharks. Or if people in publishing merely percieved fanfic as a threat to their profits.

[redsliver]

I understand why people don't make fanfics for profit, I was more curious on why people, authors not publishers, would care.

[Guest Alien Pirate Pixagi]

I understand why people don't make fanfics for profit, I was more curious on why people, authors not publishers, would care.

Cain and I were talking about the profit thing earlier, actually. He said he'd only allow people to sell their fanfics of his works (and ours) ONLY if they can prove they wrote them because they love the characters, NOT because they're trying to make a quick buck from something WE worked so hard to set up.

ESPECIALLY in this case, where he and I have been working for near a YEAR to build an entire world, economic system, and several cultures/races to put in this world, I'd hate to see someone just out to make a quick buck off something WE did all the real work on.

Making a novel isn't hard, it's making a GOOD novel that's tricky.

However, if a person wrote a novel based from what we've already published, if we liked the story and the author was willing to agree with our terms (how much we'd get paid in royalties), we'd not only allow them to publish, we'd help them.

I think, for one, the reason some author's wouldn't want fan fiction to be made of their work is simply because the characters/world/situation has a lot of meaning to them and feel it's being cheapened by fan fiction.

[Schmetterling-Meeko]

You can acknowledge that fan fiction is being made of your story, but to read the fan fiction written can cause legal problems. I wish I had some websites to the court cases on the subject caused between disagreements with the writer and the fan fiction writer. It's all really personal choice on the subject. Professionally, my personal opinion is that I wouldn't acknowledge it though it is flattering. So if it happened, it happened, I don't think I would press charges as long as it didn't interfer with what I'm trying to achieve as a writer.

I know a few cases and have run into it, where a fan fiction writer is actually making money off of rewriting an author's work. Author's don't make much money as it is. Your first book, if you are lucky might sell for between 5,000 - 10,000 dollars. The publishing house has to make that money back by selling your novels before you get royalities. If someone has rewritten your novel, you are pretty much halving the cost of your intellectual work.

[Guest Agaib]

you can't own ideas, that's silly.

Isn't that basically what a patent is? When you take out a patent on an invention you're not patenting a specific object in your possession. You're patenting the idea of the creation.

There's nothing wrong with owning ideas. Large cooperations can get a little out of hand with it though, like trying to patent the "click."

[redsliver]

Isn't that basically what a patent is?

Patents expire, copyrights don't.

[Guest Agaib]

Copyrights don't expire?

In most of the world the default length of copyright for many works is generally the life of the author plus either 50 or 70 years.

I know Wikipedia isn't exactly the most definitive source of information, but I do know that as of 11:02 PM Eastern that wikipedia disagrees with you.

You might be right *shrugs* I'm not exactly an expert on intellectual property.

EDIT: In retrospect, its says "in most of the world" which doesn't necessarily include the United States. What are the US's laws on copyrights?

[EveKnight75]

U.S. Copyright Office

How long does copyright protection last?

Copyright Act

Cornell University Law School: US Code Collection: Title 17 - Copyrights

--------------------

Copyright Board of Canada: Copyright Act

Canadian Intellectual Property Office: A Guide to Copyrights: Copyright Protection

University of Ottawa: Canadian Internet Policy and Public Interest Clinic: Copyright Law

--------------------

World Intellectual Property Organization: Index for Berne Convention

Berne Convention for the Protection of Literary and Artistic Works

--------------------

I know that some of you may be tempted to use and but don't forget who holds the here.

[redsliver]

Thank you Eve, quite informative I feel a lot better.

Still it doesn't mention that Disney and Lucas lobbyists will succeed in extending copyright law the next time any of their holdings are threatened with the public domain. That's what I meant by them not expiring, I know there's an expiry date, it just keeps getting extended.

What was wrong with it being 7 to 14 years? Protected the interests of the publishers and creators while at the same time encouraging new ventures.

[Guest Alien Pirate Pixagi]

Thank you Eve, quite informative I feel a lot better.

Still it doesn't mention that Disney and Lucas lobbyists will succeed in extending copyright law the next time any of their holdings are threatened with the public domain. That's what I meant by them not expiring, I know there's an expiry date, it just keeps getting extended.

What was wrong with it being 7 to 14 years? Protected the interests of the publishers and creators while at the same time encouraging new ventures.

Hmmm, I prefer the "Until the author's dead" deal more.

[Schmetterling-Meeko]

Hmmm, I prefer the "Until the author's dead" deal more.

I'm with you on that one.

[EveKnight75]

I'd have to agree with that. An author can control a copyright while s/he's alive. Who takes care of the copyright while the copyright owner is dead? It just seems a bit iffy to me.

Personally, I'd want to own a copyright while I was still alive, then sign it over to someone else in my will. It would have to be someone I trusted or an honorable organization that would treat the copyright well. I still say Barrie went the right way when he turned the copyright for Peter Pan over to a children's hospital (though I wouldn't do quite that because of my history with children's hospitals.)

[Kyouryoku Senshi]

I don't believe that it's within our right to prevent people from writing fanfiction, only to prevent them from profiting from such works.

I pretty much agree with this sentiment. As long as it's for the personal enjoyment of the fans and no profit is being made from it then, I'd say it's fine.

[FairlightMuse]

I most certainly would. I want them to write lots and lots of fan fiction for their own perverted pleasure, I want them to post it on places like this, and get lot's of views and make lot's of friends who share ships in common with them. As long as I am making all the money, of course.

I love being able to write fanfiction, so what kind of hyprocrite would I be if I refused that pleasure to my fans?

[EveKnight75]

I love being able to write fanfiction, so what kind of hyprocrite would I be if I refused that pleasure to my fans?

Anne Rice? Lee Goldberg? Take your pick, there's a long list out there.

[StoryJunkie]

I voted "I don't know"

Maybe I'll develop a Napoleon complex. Seeing as I'm so mentally disease free at the moment. Yes, I PLAN on it. I'll develop a Napoleon complex and ...wait aminute. That would make sense if I knew a famous author, or was the doorman at the building in which they worked. OK. Scrub that.

What was I going to say now?

Oh yeah. Very often, when the tables are turned, it isn't as fun as when the fan-ficking was done by us. (If you get my drift.)

What I mean to say is: I ..(okay, I have to be searingly honest with you, so prepare to be shocked)...I fell in love with one or two of my (original) characters, and I would hate to see them compromised. I'm not really a yaoi fan, and if someone turned someone who was abused gay while the gay guy (who really is straight), loses all his power because of it or some kind of...nevermind. I'm warping my own mind with the thought.

[Elvy]

I think I would be absolutely flattered that someone took the time to write a fic based on any of my own original material.