Hiccup the Overlord discussion thread

[Strange_idea]

And i can help with writers block, or at least try

[Strange_idea]

And it's okay to use the empire a loy. I just try to suggest things to mix up the circumstances of their involvement a bit.

[Jwsponky]

1 hour ago, Strange_idea said:

Eh, look at it this way. You've made it this far and planned for this much. If you like the film you can make a mini-sequel with nods to some disney sequels.

 

1 hour ago, Strange_idea said:

And it's okay to use the empire a loy. I just try to suggest things to mix up the circumstances of their involvement a bit.

Fair enough, fair enough…

 

Been struck by another idea for the larger ‘what if Hiccup managed to give himself wings’ idea…

What if instead of the ‘normal’ bird wings that Maleficent had, the feathers of Hiccup’s wings were harder/stiffer, think the wings of the Stymphalian birds of Greek mythology minus the ability to fling their feathers like throwing knives, allowing his wings to block or deflect arrows or sword blows?

Probably wouldn’t manage to stop an axe or spear, be it stabbing or throwing variety though...

Edited June 8, 2018 by Jwsponky

[Strange_idea]

Tjat could work, and it would limit him to gliding maneuvers like his canonical winguit, which still means he depends on toothless for flight. Plus, if we went with the 'part of the armour' idea it could be called a side effect of that.

[Strange_idea]

It could be a school of combat the wingmaidens specialise in

[Jwsponky]

19 minutes ago, Strange_idea said:

It could be a school of combat the wingmaidens specialise in

That is a possibility I had not considered…

 

Another thought has occurred to me about the idea of ‘What if Hiccup grew quills on his shoulders that move with his mood like a dog’s ears as a nod to the spikes the Overlord can grow in the first game?’…

What if in addition to the quills on his shoulders, he grew quills on his head, either in addition to or slowly replacing his hair, at first glance bearing some resemblance to the frill of a Nadder or Skrill?

[Strange_idea]

Hmmmmm

Okay? Remwmber how i mentioned 'drive forms' to you once?

 

Well what if he had a few different armours that each made a different transformation like this happen? The quill armour could also toughen hisbhide and give him sharpened claws and teeth

[Jwsponky]

1 minute ago, Strange_idea said:

Hmmmmm

Okay? Remwmber how i mentioned 'drive forms' to you once?

 

Well what if he had a few different armours that each made a different transformation like this happen? The quill armour could also toughen hisbhide and give him sharpened claws and teeth

That is a possibility I had not considered… if I did include the idea of the quills I had intended for it to just be a side effect of being Overlord, hmm...

 

Been struck by a rather random thought, What if in this story Valka was an elf, making Hiccup a human/elf hybrid?

[Strange_idea]

That coyld work. It would explain another reason why she had to retreat to the dragon sanctuary. I take it he doesn't know?

You could hint at it by mentioning pointed ears but also hint its an overlord thing.

Would that mean Valka is younger? You could hint again by saying she aged incredibly well

[Jwsponky]

5 minutes ago, Strange_idea said:

That could work. It would explain another reason why she had to retreat to the dragon sanctuary. I take it he doesn't know?

You could hint at it by mentioning pointed ears but also hint its an overlord thing.

Would that mean Valka is younger? You could hint again by saying she aged incredibly well

Hmm.. Hiccup not knowing was not an angle I had considered, given that I had assumed the vaguely bluish hides that most of the elves of the Overlord franchise exhibit crossed with the vaguely pinkish tone of human hide would produce a child with a faint purple tint to their skin… And now I'm struck by the idle thought ‘what if the blood of the elves in the Overlord franchise was blue?’

Granted now that I think about it the idea of Valka being an elf would interfere with my vague plan for her to have been a member of the Berserker tribe, possibly sister to Oswald the Agreeable, married to Stoick as part of the peace treaty...

[Strange_idea]

Yeah, it probably would. Unless she's adopted.

 

And I'd advise against giving hiccup blue skin, it'd be jarring for someone to read a familar description then it ends with blue or purple skin.

Unless you make it something like 'he gets blue easily' and people note he's looking a little blue. Just don't outright SAY it

[Jwsponky]

3 minutes ago, Strange_idea said:

Yeah, it probably would. Unless she's adopted.

 

And I'd advise against giving hiccup blue skin, it'd be jarring for someone to read a familar description then it ends with blue or purple skin.

Unless you make it something like 'he gets blue easily' and people note he's looking a little blue. Just don't outright SAY it

Fair enough about the blue/purple skin, but any thought about the idea of the elves in general having pale blue blood?

[Strange_idea]

Random olympus idea. Circe could be artemis based on the animals thing. She's done it as well actually

[Strange_idea]

Hinting at blue skin is fine.

 

I do like the blue/purple blood idea.

Sorry pale blue. Don't know where i got purple.

Edited June 8, 2018 by Strange_idea

[Strange_idea]

You could do the elf thing if you made her adopted. You could have her assume everyone knew because she was an elf for goodness sake!

I dunno. Up to you. You could do a few thibgs with it. Maybe he can save fays life by joing her in charging a crystal

[Jwsponky]

3 minutes ago, Strange_idea said:

Random olympus idea. Circe could be artemis based on the animals thing. She's done it as well actually

That would work, and I've been struck by the idea of Electra receiving the power of Zeus, upgrading her ‘furies’ into ‘thunderbirds’, though given what I remember of the show she was rather anti authority, which would mean she probably wouldn’t want to be an Overlord’s mistress given that the position of Overlord is about as authority as it gets...

 

3 minutes ago, Strange_idea said:

Hinting at blue skin is fine.

 

I do like the blue/purple blood idea.

I admit I’m undecided about the idea of Valka being an elfess… woelf… what if the term for a elf woman anyway?.. it was mainly a passing thought to make Hiccup a half elf, with the quills potentially being explained away as an unforeseen effect of crossing the two species

Also, since you recommended ‘Maleficent’ to me, which I watched yesterday and have to say was solidly ‘meh’, not great but not horribly either, I shall invoke ‘turn about is fair play’ and recommend a movie to you, the film ‘Strange Magic’, mainly because it has the character that partly gave me the idea for Hiccup to grow quills, the Bog King, since he has a similar personality that I'm trying for with Overlord Hiccup, plays up being evil to justify his actions, in the Bog King’s case the banning of love potions, a dangerous mind altering substance, and imprisoning the one person who can make them, and will for nearly anyone regardless of their intent, but is actually a just ruler and fairly nice guy, as well as incidentally being king of the goblins.

[Strange_idea]

Will do, i've heard of it before.

But having seen it, doees the direction i was reccomending for malefient make sense?

(I mostly liked the old-fairy style thing and take on maleficent)

 

 

Also, thunderbird is a completely different thing. I'm REALLY big on mythology

[Strange_idea]

I do understand it being meh. There were some good moments but a lot of it admittedly blurs together

[Strange_idea]

Although if hiccup is playing up being evil, if he still has his canon personality want to a recurring gag that has the disney girls failing to fall for it?

[Strange_idea]

The thunderbird would make a lot of sense in agrabah

[Strange_idea]

Also, did a backgtoumd check and apparently ursula was implied to be banished for making evil copy tridents, so maybe she instructed hiccup in magic weapons, or she does whemln she finds him making them. Hicxup would probably be surprised.

 

Also, her actress likened ursula to a shakespearean performer and her 'decendants' version likes soaps, so i imagine one thing she could sincerely enjoy teaching hiccup is drama

[Jwsponky]

9 hours ago, Strange_idea said:

Will do, i've heard of it before.

But having seen it, doees the direction i was reccomending for malefient make sense?

(I mostly liked the old-fairy style thing and take on maleficent)

 

 

Also, thunderbird is a completely different thing. I'm REALLY big on mythology

 

9 hours ago, Strange_idea said:

I do understand it being meh. There were some good moments but a lot of it admittedly blurs together

 

9 hours ago, Strange_idea said:

Although if hiccup is playing up being evil, if he still has his canon personality want to a recurring gag that has the disney girls failing to fall for it?

 

7 hours ago, Strange_idea said:

The thunderbird would make a lot of sense in agrabah

 

7 hours ago, Strange_idea said:

Also, did a backgtoumd check and apparently ursula was implied to be banished for making evil copy tridents, so maybe she instructed hiccup in magic weapons, or she does whemln she finds him making them. Hicxup would probably be surprised.

 

Also, her actress likened ursula to a shakespearean performer and her 'decendants' version likes soaps, so i imagine one thing she could sincerely enjoy teaching hiccup is drama

Sorry it took me a bit to reply, the site decided to let me see that you said something, but not reply…

I understand your suggestion, though in the movie I am unsure if Maleficent's regret was willing, or if she was hit by the 'she shall be beloved by all she meets' clause of her curse, I'm also unsure how they made the leap of logic to turn king Stefan from heart broken father who had to send his daughter away for 16 years for her own safety to power mad tyrant...

I am aware that the thunderbird is a separate entity from the mythology of several Native American tribes, though I think there are some African tribes that have tales of a similar beast called a lightningbird, I was merely using it as shorthand for a bird with lightning powers

That would be a fair running gag, possibly with Hiccup genuinely lamenting the fact that people don't fear him, having been raised to believe fear and respect are more or less synonymous

The idea of Ursula teaching Hiccup how to design enchanted weapons has merit as well as trying to instill in Hiccup an appreciation of dramatic entrances

[Strange_idea]

7 hours ago, Jwsponky said:

understand your suggestion, though in the movie I am unsure if Maleficent's regret was willing, or if she was hit by the 'she shall be beloved by all she meets' clause of her curse, I'm also unsure how they made the leap of logic to turn king Stefan from heart broken father who had to send his daughter away for 16 years for her own safety to power mad tyrant...

Well, he had very little character or screentime in thr first one and they needed to make maleficent look good. Though i do appreciate her genuinly being the bad guy at parts.

I do see the spell as part of it, but it's plausible anough that years with a human girl who genuinely likes you and forces you to think about other people plus someone willing to call.you out on your mistakes would help you see past your hatred for her father. Really her grudge was with him so blmeeting another human and getting over it for them alone is understandable.

Cute detail, what if aurora has a stuffed raven? Also we could slip dival in as a raven-shaped sending/scrying/speaking spell

 

 

Neat bit of trivia, in the scene where baby aurora sees maleficent and giggles, they used angelina jolies baby becausr the makeup scared any other. But baby jolie just saw mommy and lit right up.

 

7 hours ago, Jwsponky said:

That would be a fair running gag, possibly with Hiccup genuinely lamenting the fact that people don't fear him, having been raised to believe fear and respect are more or less synonymous

First, 

"Why is nobody afraid of me?"

"Not nobody, just nobody who's met you"

 

Second, hello further conflict with elsa and character growth for arendale

 

7 hours ago, Jwsponky said:

The idea of Ursula teaching Hiccup how to design enchanted weapons has merit as well as trying to instill in Hiccup an appreciation of dramatic entrances

I can see her cheering him on when he actually pulls them iff or rating his one-liners. The others are surprised when she does the first.

Also? Since the extra material books are vauge on her being trions ex lover or sister, we could have the others say she keeps chamging the story, and whem cursed triton shows up he/she doesn't even hear it before saying whatever she says is probably a lie.

[Jwsponky]

4 hours ago, Strange_idea said:

Well, he had very little character or screentime in thr first one and they needed to make maleficent look good. Though i do appreciate her genuinly being the bad guy at parts.

I do see the spell as part of it, but it's plausible anough that years with a human girl who genuinely likes you and forces you to think about other people plus someone willing to call.you out on your mistakes would help you see past your hatred for her father. Really her grudge was with him so blmeeting another human and getting over it for them alone is understandable.

Cute detail, what if aurora has a stuffed raven? Also we could slip dival in as a raven-shaped sending/scrying/speaking spell

 

 

Neat bit of trivia, in the scene where baby aurora sees maleficent and giggles, they used angelina jolies baby becausr the makeup scared any other. But baby jolie just saw mommy and lit right up.

 

First, 

"Why is nobody afraid of me?"

"Not nobody, just nobody who's met you"

 

Second, hello further conflict with elsa and character growth for arendale

 

I can see her cheering him on when he actually pulls them iff or rating his one-liners. The others are surprised when she does the first.

Also? Since the extra material books are vauge on her being trions ex lover or sister, we could have the others say she keeps chamging the story, and whem cursed triton shows up he/she doesn't even hear it before saying whatever she says is probably a lie.

Fair point on Stefan's lack of character in the first movie, and I've been struck by an idea based on a passing remark you made aways back about Maleficent sending Aurora good dreams with Hiccup being her handsome 'prince'…

What if said dreams were enough to make Aurora love Hiccup, poking a bit of fun at the line 'we met once upon a dream' from  the original, so when Hiccup finds Aurora's sleeping form, Maleficent tells him to kiss her, much to his confusion but he  ultimately trusts his adopted mother, and the one-sided love managed to break the spell? 

I'd probably have Maleficent mention that if that didn't work 'a fairy godmother's' love was her plan B.

 

The first one is amusing, and I've been struck by a possibly funny scene involving the Arendelle arc, what if before he went off in search of the run away elder princess, Hiccup realized that by 'rushing off to save the missing fair maiden' he was technically the hero of this tale, a fact that makes him slightly ill until one of the  other characters, probably Anna, reminds him that its his faulty the 'fair maiden' needs saving in the first place, which he genuinely thanks them for?

 

The idea of Ursula always changing the tale about her past is rather amusing

 

A thought has occurred to me though, approximately how long should it be between the reigns of the original Overlord, the Black Baron who made the Tower Heart and original Minions, and Hiccup?

Edited June 9, 2018 by Jwsponky

[Strange_idea]

10 minutes ago, Jwsponky said:

A thought has occurred to me though, approximately how long should it be between the reigns of the original Overlord, the Black Baron who !Ade the Tower Heart and original Minions, and Hiccup?

 

At least four generations if we have hiccup be the guy in the first game (three overlords and the baron).

 

10 minutes ago, Jwsponky said:

Fair point on Stefan's lack of character in the first movie, and I've been struck by an idea based on a passing remark you made aways back about Maleficent sending Aurora good dreams with Hiccup being her handsome 'prince'…

What if said dreams were enough to make Aurora love Hiccup, poking a bit of fun at the line 'we met once upon a dream' from  the original, so when Hiccup finds Aurora's sleeping form, Maleficent tells him to kiss her, much to his confusion but he  ultimately trusts his adopted mother, and the one-sided love managed to break the spell? 

I'd probably have Maleficent mention that if that didn't work 'a fairy godmother's' love was her plan B.

hmmm……okay, true love’s kiss was the thing that broke the spell here and the reason the prince didn;t work in the remake was because it wasn’t deep enough so a one-sided love probably wouldn’t be enough…… okay, can i take this in a new direction by combining this with mine? This is partially because characters need to fail every now and then.

Maleficent has been sending her dreams for years, reading to her, but became convinced it was just a lie she told herself when she found hiccup and focused on him. However, shen she slept she still sent dreams of herself and Hiccup to aurora, allowing a relationship to grow.

alternatively, she found out about aurora while spying on the heroes and found her when oberon did. so she started the plan then. this is the way i’m leaning. in this one, the kiss doesn’t work and a defeated maleficent asks hiccup to bring her back with him. Maleficent tells her the plan and what’s happened while she slept, but can;t kiss her because she feels too guilty and selfish. so instead she kisses her forehead goodnight. That actually works, something she wasn’t expecting. This distracts her enough that mim steals the ‘’titania’ persona and seduces hiccup.

another explanation, aurora’s latent witchcraft let her dream of visions, particularly her mother and the people around her, just filtered through a fairytail motif.

part of this could be that to a degree, maleficent actually raised hiccup based on an imaginary prince her daughter always dreamed up, just with her own twists.

 

fourth explanation, Maleficent posseses hiccup with his permission to give the kiss, just to make sure. Aurora thinks it’s a prince at first, but recognises her ‘mother’s’ eyes and tone, and is overjoyed

 

 

10 minutes ago, Jwsponky said:

The first one is amusing, and I've been struck by a possibly fun scene involving the Arendelle arc, what if before he went off in search of the run away elder princess, Hiccup realized that by 'rushing off to save the missing fair maiden' he was technically the hero of this tale, a fact that makes him slightly ill until one of the  other characters, probably Anna, reminds him that its his faulty the 'fair maiden' needs saving in the first place, which he genuinely thanks them for?

 

and can we have anna ask how often he does this when he’s out of earshot and….. either zarina or mirage (whoever’s there) how often he does this. actually, she asks toothless.

Anna: he does this a lot?

Toothless: * grin and nod *

Anna: First time he put the girl in distress?

Toothless: *visibly holding in laughter*

 

funny and helps her fall for him