Avaloyuru

I’m pretty much into elf slash, and I’ve written my favourites. So those would be (in no particular order):
Sauron/Maglor
Elrond/The Mirkwood Three (and combinations thereof), which is to say Oropher, Thranduil and Legolas
Elrond/Young!Thranduil
Acutally, Elrond/pretty much anyone, including Celebrian
Thranduil/Legolas (with Tafkab)
Erestor/Twins (with Tafkab)
Glorfindel/Erestor (I lost a lot of chapters when I got rid of a duplicate story in the archives, and I never really got over that)
Glorfindel/Gildor (with BronxWench)
Legolas/Gimli
I’m sure there are more. I was starting to enjoy writing little bits of Celeborn/Thranduil and Galion/Legolas when I kind of lost my muse. I was also getting to know Curufin/Celegorm, and I’d just begun advancing the S/M into Melkor/Sauron territory.
Maybe it will come back. I hope so. I mean, The Teacher is kind of like my life’s work of the past 10+ years, and I’d like to finish it someday.
 

I felt a bit cheated, with the movies, I mean, with the Hobbit at three, then certainly the LoTR could’ve been six, or even nine!  Imagine, the scouring of the shire, a nice little short story by itself, could’ve made it in.

Thank you Avaloyuru!
I was just playing around a bit. Mashed a couple of co-authored stories together, and the characters in them.
It’s so long since I wrote for lotr.. I have to get back there eventually. At the moment, I write what the muse tells me to. But I miss Glorfindel and Gildor. And Elrond.. I miss him. And Thranduil. And Legolas. *sighs* I don’t miss Sauron.

In general, I love to read about Elves. Pairings with Hobbits or Dwarves are not to my liking.....it's just difficult for me to imagine, for example, a Hobbit paired with a Men and such...
It really depends on how a story is written and how the characters are portrayed, but I like to read about these pairings:
Elrohir/Legolas
Elrohir/Lindir
->I like stories with the twins in general
Erestor/Glorfindel (but please no overly shy or strangely behaving Erestor :
Erestor/Ereinion
What about you? What pairings do you like?

Wow! Thank you so much, CL!
I'll try and give a coherent response to all of this. What an amazing review!
(Chapter 1) Well, we had options, but in the end, Thranduil's clear obsession with wine could not be ignored. Expanding the wine cellar? Yeah, that sounds like him. Lol, seriously, we had to use a trope for this, and forced proximity mixed with a near death scare won out.
(Chapter 2) Yes. On the surface, it seems Thranduil finds it easier to face. But who knows what's going off inside his head? *g*
(Chapter 3) Okay, so I can't speak for TAFKAB, but I think Thranduil was assuming Legolas would want to forget all about it. Especially since he was necking that wine like water. When Legolas appeared in his room, it startled him, and he fell back into a role he knows well, hence all the Dom instructions. But then, when Legolas embraced him, it melted his heart. How could it not?
As for Legolas, I definitely see him as quite capable of embarking on this, even though he hasn't got a clue what is coming. It will be a journey for him, knowing how kinky Thranduil is, but he won't be damaged by it. For me, he's still quite playful, and that will come out at times.
(Chapter 4) Thranduil does love Legolas very much, as his son, and he's still aggrieved that his actions have damaged him forever. But, as Legolas said here, the door is open and cannot be easily shut. Legolas does not intend to allow it to be shut on him, for all that Thranduil considers himself the dominant partner. Maybe the silly elven King is fooling himself there too? Maybe there is a bit of both going on? Oohh... maybe...
Again, thank you, and I hope you enjoy the rest of the story. We are well in front, so will be posting more in a few days

Wow, Bronx I don't know what to say. Thank you so much for all of these wonderful words! I am sure TAFKAB will reply too, but I love to get your responses. They make my day, every single time
It occurred to both of us that Thranduil and Legolas, as characters, were just perfect together, and so we wanted to write something to capture that. We have plans and plots in store for these two. And quite a bit of playtime if Thranduil has anything to do with it. He's definitely driving in this relationship... at least, so far...
For myself, it's very satisfying to write a story featuring them away from The Teacher, because I do think they deserve something that revolves around them.
Legolas is innocent, and he doesn't really know what awaits him. And yet, I don't feel he is easily put off or frightened. He does go out fighting spiders, after all. He trusts Thranduil very much, and though I'm quite sure there are going to be a few rebellious moments along the way, and some surprises, I promise we won't hurt either of them. When we let them go again, they'll be happy.
We haven't collaborated on anything else so far, but I did write TAFKAB's Gimli and Legolas, and TAFKAB has written my version of Elrond in a very dominant roleplay that is incredibly hot. Soon, I will make TAFKAB post it here. *nudges TAFKAB*

Have to admit I was wondering about the sudden surge in comments on years old topics, but I’m guessing the debate still rages today, and it’s every bit as relevant.
A web comic about Sue: http://interrobangstudios.com/comics-display.php?strip_id=989
I try to avoid Sues myself (maybe name a non-sue OC as Sue….?)  However, if Sue is what floats a particular author, gets ‘em writing, gives them experience to then go back and judge, that’s okay too, because we all have to start somewhere and we’ll all make mistakes (unless the byline is Mary Sue...she’ll get it perfect the first time).

Wow!  A lot of insights on these Mary/Marty Sue characters, the good, the bad, and the ugly so to speak.  I don’t judge those who use these types of characters, however, personally, I don’t use them (based on the definition I understand them to be) but I totally and completely get the concept that type of writing provides, regardless of the genre, it is a personal expression and should be viewed as such.  I'm just now getting back into writing after about a 20-25 year break, it's amazing to me that Fan-Fiction has actually been around that long, but then again not!
I think it's important to remember that there is an audience for every type or style of writing, even for the ‘out of this world, totally perfect’ non-canon characters.  Some readers are simply looking for an escape so to speak from the normal routine of a particular storyline, these characters do that for them and it’s a good thing!  It won’t and shouldn’t blow their minds so speak about the original storyline.  I compare it to my choice of genre and accept the fact that there are some (a lot of) people that are offended by graphically described sexual acts whether they are normal (if there is such a thing) or blatant erotica and that that entails.  I love being the antagonist, I don’t want some superhero coming in to save the day or a bumbling idiot for the sake of humor.
It’s just a personal choice, but I tend to do enormous amounts of research when it comes to canon characters and I do my best (in my opinion) to maintain some form of continuity to that character.  With that being said, when I choose to create a new character from the ground up, all that research is heavily relied on in an effort to make them fit into the world I’m writing.
For example, my current (and forever shall be) obsession is Tolkien, so I resort to my membership in various Tolkien Societies to create these ‘new’ characters so they will fit in.  Every character has their own bio-sheet that describes everything about them, some are several pages long depending on what role they are to play in the story.  I have about seven personally created characters in my overall cast for the Hobbit/LOTR.  Introducing them to canon characters can sometimes be difficult if I intend to run some form of a parallel path with the original authors' ideology.  Beyond the fact that I completely adore Tolkiens’ works, I think the gaps in time, the abundance of unknowns, and the general ‘left undone’ and missing parts of his works leave a lot of room for Fan-Fiction creativity.  There’s always an interesting side story to tell (evil grin).
Respectfully speaking, I am not judging anyone regardless of their use or non-use of these types of characters.  In another site, I still belong to (because they have great resources), these types of characters are forbidden which I think is wrong.  It is now strictly a Hobbit/LOTR site and the admins are getting pretty picking if you get ‘too far out of line’ (in their opinion) with canon characters.  No writer should be limited in their creativity as long as there is an audience that is reading their work.
Thanks for reading, it’s just another point of view.

Wow!  A lot of insights on these Mary/Marty Sue characters, the good, the bad, and the ugly so to speak.  I don’t judge those who use these types of characters, however, personally, I don’t use them (based on the definition I understand them to be) but I totally and completely get the concept that type of writing provides, regardless of the genre, it is a personal expression and should be viewed as such.  I'm just now getting back into writing after about a 20-25 year break, it's amazing to me that Fan-Fiction has actually been around that long, but then again not!
I think it's important to remember that there is an audience for every type or style of writing, even for the ‘out of this world, totally perfect’ non-canon characters.  Some readers are simply looking for an escape so to speak from the normal routine of a particular storyline, these characters do that for them and it’s a good thing!  It won’t and shouldn’t blow their minds so speak about the original storyline.  I compare it to my choice of genre and accept the fact that there are some (a lot of) people that are offended by graphically described sexual acts whether they are normal (if there is such a thing) or blatant erotica and that that entails.  I love being the antagonist, I don’t want some superhero coming in to save the day or a bumbling idiot for the sake of humor.
It’s just a personal choice, but I tend to do enormous amounts of research when it comes to canon characters and I do my best (in my opinion) to maintain some form of continuity to that character.  With that being said, when I choose to create a new character from the ground up, all that research is heavily relied on in an effort to make them fit into the world I’m writing.
For example, my current (and forever shall be) obsession is Tolkien, so I resort to my membership in various Tolkien Societies to create these ‘new’ characters so they will fit in.  Every character has their own bio-sheet that describes everything about them, some are several pages long depending on what role they are to play in the story.  I have about seven personally created characters in my overall cast for the Hobbit/LOTR.  Introducing them to canon characters can sometimes be difficult if I intend to run some form of a parallel path with the original authors' ideology.  Beyond the fact that I completely adore Tolkiens’ works, I think the gaps in time, the abundance of unknowns, and the general ‘left undone’ and missing parts of his works leave a lot of room for Fan-Fiction creativity.  There’s always an interesting side story to tell (evil grin).
Respectfully speaking, I am not judging anyone regardless of their use or non-use of these types of characters.  In another site, I still belong to (because they have great resources), these types of characters are forbidden which I think is wrong.  It is now strictly a Hobbit/LOTR site and the admins are getting pretty picking if you get ‘too far out of line’ (in their opinion) with canon characters.  No writer should be limited in their creativity as long as there is an audience that is reading their work.
Thanks for reading, it’s just another point of view.

I do both Fan-Fiction and Original Works so I have a lot of OC’s on file.  When it comes to Fan-Fiction, I see my OC’s in the same position and purpose as a supporting actor/actress in a movie.  Each of them has their 'backstory' so to speak which is thoroughly researched and compiled on a bio-sheet that can be anywhere from one to several pages in length, depending on their role in the story.  I try not to create what I call ‘disposable’ characters simply because of the amount of time and effort that goes into creating them just to have them killed off or something.
As far as their ‘backstory’ I reveal only as much and when as necessary to the reader in order to both maintain the continuity of the storyline as well as the canon character(s) they are supporting or to accommodate the drama of a particular scenario being played out.  OC’s play an important role in a lot of Fan-Fiction because they have the ability to contribute certain aspects to the storyline that canon characters cannot, particularly if the writer is to maintain (their concept) of the canon character.
I know there are writers that have canon characters do or say things that I find completely out of character based on my research.  However, even though it is Fan-Fiction, I agree that there is a certain level of creativity that should be allowed. Because in cases where a certain action is not addressed either for or against, I myself have had canon characters do things that the original creator would probably flip out over.

LOL @CloverReef Thanks for the shout out!  Absolutely!  There are a number of forum threads that are a few years old that I’m reading and commenting on over the past couple of days.  I know there are a lot of voyeurs in here that I hope will take something positive away from what we share here.  I’m still trying to learn a lot of new things, particularly when it comes to initials used to describe things.  Some, like OC’s are easy to figure out, others not so much.  I find myself having these DUH moments, LOL.
I have to admit the title of 'Mary Sue' is new to me, it wasn't something I heard 20-25 years ago when I first started writing Fan-Fic but reading through some of the forums I understand it.  We all write for different reasons and purposes which are what determines the need or rejection of these types of characters.  I've read a few stories with them included, some were very nicely written while others were for what I call humor relief.  The writer may not agree with me but hey, I got something out of the story and somebody out there loved what they wrote and that's what it's all about.
For example, I'm currently working on a short 'break out' story for this site.  It's a bit mild in the erotic area than my usual choice and it's F/M instead of M/M.  But at the same time, there is a purpose in this 'episode' and that is to introduce a deeper element (that I see) in a Hobbit/LOTR canon character.  This storyline actually has more OC’s than canon characters LOL

Wow!  A lot of insights on these Mary/Marty Sue characters, the good, the bad, and the ugly so to speak.  I don’t judge those who use these types of characters, however, personally, I don’t use them (based on the definition I understand them to be) but I totally and completely get the concept that type of writing provides, regardless of the genre, it is a personal expression and should be viewed as such.  I'm just now getting back into writing after about a 20-25 year break, it's amazing to me that Fan-Fiction has actually been around that long, but then again not!
I think it's important to remember that there is an audience for every type or style of writing, even for the ‘out of this world, totally perfect’ non-canon characters.  Some readers are simply looking for an escape so to speak from the normal routine of a particular storyline, these characters do that for them and it’s a good thing!  It won’t and shouldn’t blow their minds so speak about the original storyline.  I compare it to my choice of genre and accept the fact that there are some (a lot of) people that are offended by graphically described sexual acts whether they are normal (if there is such a thing) or blatant erotica and that that entails.  I love being the antagonist, I don’t want some superhero coming in to save the day or a bumbling idiot for the sake of humor.
It’s just a personal choice, but I tend to do enormous amounts of research when it comes to canon characters and I do my best (in my opinion) to maintain some form of continuity to that character.  With that being said, when I choose to create a new character from the ground up, all that research is heavily relied on in an effort to make them fit into the world I’m writing.
For example, my current (and forever shall be) obsession is Tolkien, so I resort to my membership in various Tolkien Societies to create these ‘new’ characters so they will fit in.  Every character has their own bio-sheet that describes everything about them, some are several pages long depending on what role they are to play in the story.  I have about seven personally created characters in my overall cast for the Hobbit/LOTR.  Introducing them to canon characters can sometimes be difficult if I intend to run some form of a parallel path with the original authors' ideology.  Beyond the fact that I completely adore Tolkiens’ works, I think the gaps in time, the abundance of unknowns, and the general ‘left undone’ and missing parts of his works leave a lot of room for Fan-Fiction creativity.  There’s always an interesting side story to tell (evil grin).
Respectfully speaking, I am not judging anyone regardless of their use or non-use of these types of characters.  In another site, I still belong to (because they have great resources), these types of characters are forbidden which I think is wrong.  It is now strictly a Hobbit/LOTR site and the admins are getting pretty picking if you get ‘too far out of line’ (in their opinion) with canon characters.  No writer should be limited in their creativity as long as there is an audience that is reading their work.
Thanks for reading, it’s just another point of view.

In some ways, I do and yet I don’t really care whether every reader even likes any or all of my characters much less holds out hope for some form of redemption.  I will provide the redemption in my own way, even though most will not see it.  As with all things, there is a balance most commonly sought between the readers' perception of right/wrong, good/evil, etc.
The character traits that I tend to instill within my original works are more along the lines of attitude and personality because it's so much fun to let out the evil now once the reader has 'fallen in love' with the character.  Unless of course, they're looking for a goody-goody which is entirely boring!  Characters that have the ability to reach out and grab the hearts and minds of the reader should be just as diversified (within the contextual setting) as people are in real-life.  People, in my opinion, are like diamonds, there are many facets to an individual personality.  Which one sparkles depends greatly on which way you turn the diamond, so it should apply to characters.
I’ve read through numerous stories in the archives and honestly, the ones I love the most are the ones that hold my attention because as a reader there is some level of redemption sought, but it’s the fact that I didn’t get my way that makes the story so much more appealing to me.

Wow!  A lot of insights on these Mary/Marty Sue characters, the good, the bad, and the ugly so to speak.  I don’t judge those who use these types of characters, however, personally, I don’t use them (based on the definition I understand them to be) but I totally and completely get the concept that type of writing provides, regardless of the genre, it is a personal expression and should be viewed as such.  I'm just now getting back into writing after about a 20-25 year break, it's amazing to me that Fan-Fiction has actually been around that long, but then again not!
I think it's important to remember that there is an audience for every type or style of writing, even for the ‘out of this world, totally perfect’ non-canon characters.  Some readers are simply looking for an escape so to speak from the normal routine of a particular storyline, these characters do that for them and it’s a good thing!  It won’t and shouldn’t blow their minds so speak about the original storyline.  I compare it to my choice of genre and accept the fact that there are some (a lot of) people that are offended by graphically described sexual acts whether they are normal (if there is such a thing) or blatant erotica and that that entails.  I love being the antagonist, I don’t want some superhero coming in to save the day or a bumbling idiot for the sake of humor.
It’s just a personal choice, but I tend to do enormous amounts of research when it comes to canon characters and I do my best (in my opinion) to maintain some form of continuity to that character.  With that being said, when I choose to create a new character from the ground up, all that research is heavily relied on in an effort to make them fit into the world I’m writing.
For example, my current (and forever shall be) obsession is Tolkien, so I resort to my membership in various Tolkien Societies to create these ‘new’ characters so they will fit in.  Every character has their own bio-sheet that describes everything about them, some are several pages long depending on what role they are to play in the story.  I have about seven personally created characters in my overall cast for the Hobbit/LOTR.  Introducing them to canon characters can sometimes be difficult if I intend to run some form of a parallel path with the original authors' ideology.  Beyond the fact that I completely adore Tolkiens’ works, I think the gaps in time, the abundance of unknowns, and the general ‘left undone’ and missing parts of his works leave a lot of room for Fan-Fiction creativity.  There’s always an interesting side story to tell (evil grin).
Respectfully speaking, I am not judging anyone regardless of their use or non-use of these types of characters.  In another site, I still belong to (because they have great resources), these types of characters are forbidden which I think is wrong.  It is now strictly a Hobbit/LOTR site and the admins are getting pretty picking if you get ‘too far out of line’ (in their opinion) with canon characters.  No writer should be limited in their creativity as long as there is an audience that is reading their work.
Thanks for reading, it’s just another point of view.

Not surprising. That’s a really rich world you have to work with! I look forward to seeing what you dish out, but mostly I hope to see some of your M/M stuff soon  

LOL @CloverReef Thanks for the shout out!  Absolutely!  There are a number of forum threads that are a few years old that I’m reading and commenting on over the past couple of days.  I know there are a lot of voyeurs in here that I hope will take something positive away from what we share here.  I’m still trying to learn a lot of new things, particularly when it comes to initials used to describe things.  Some, like OC’s are easy to figure out, others not so much.  I find myself having these DUH moments, LOL.
I have to admit the title of 'Mary Sue' is new to me, it wasn't something I heard 20-25 years ago when I first started writing Fan-Fic but reading through some of the forums I understand it.  We all write for different reasons and purposes which are what determines the need or rejection of these types of characters.  I've read a few stories with them included, some were very nicely written while others were for what I call humor relief.  The writer may not agree with me but hey, I got something out of the story and somebody out there loved what they wrote and that's what it's all about.
For example, I'm currently working on a short 'break out' story for this site.  It's a bit mild in the erotic area than my usual choice and it's F/M instead of M/M.  But at the same time, there is a purpose in this 'episode' and that is to introduce a deeper element (that I see) in a Hobbit/LOTR canon character.  This storyline actually has more OC’s than canon characters LOL

Wow, @Avaloyuru I think I agree with pretty much everything you just said lol. I even used to do the bio sheets too (now I just start writing and after a scene, when I’m in the head of the characters, I start to map out their personality in the planning files and make decisions about quirks and whatnot.) 

It’s been quite a few years since this thread started, and I think my views on the Mary sue/Gary stu topic have changed or evolved somewhat. I think a lot of the symptoms of that kinda character are kinda important to beginning writers, especially young ones, in sort of experimenting with character development and learning how to get in their characters heads, and learning the empathy and whatnot required to really write a powerful character. Might not be an experience all writers go through, but I think it’s a crucial one for many. 
And definitely, some writers stick to that kinda character as their weapon of choice. That’s totally legit. I used to think it was an indication of bad writing to have a mary sue character. Though I didn’t necessarily think a perfect character was mary sue, but rather a character that makes the characters around them act in nonsensical ways (like everyone in the story gushing that Suzie is such a sweetheart, even though all her appearances, she seems pretty mean and inappropriate). But the perfect character that everyone wants to be with, which often is defined as the mary sue character, can absolutely be done with tact and skill.
Everyone should do the characters that they enjoy. Personally, they’re not my cup of tea, but I’m more of a villain lover than a hero humper to begin with. 

So far I've only come a cross two OC's that I love, and only a few more that I like. To me, it seems authors have the risk of loving their own creations more than the canon figures. At least, that is how it seems in the stories I've read. But i also think that the people who write bad OC's are the same people who write the canon people out of character. That really doesn't give me much to like, lol. in general, if the author is any good at what she/he's doing, they will make the OC's likeable too. I come for the canon people, so I do think the focus should be on them, but sometimes, since you are making someone else's base fit with your story, you need to do things to flesh it out.
Am I blabbering? I might just be. I'll stop ^^

I couldn't really partake in the poll because the first part didn't allow for original stories. I assume by OC you mean OC inserted into fanfiction?
I think OC's can add a certain depth and element of creativity to a fanfiction, so long as they don't overshadow the main characters. I think creating a story set in a fanfic universe with an OC as the main character is fine. For example: an original character in the Forgotten Realms universe who is the main focus of the story, but cameos from majoy pre-existing characters can occur if done right. People write good fiction based on their World of Warcraft characters all the time. What I don't like is when an OC is Mary-Sue'd to death and breaks up a canon couple because (s)he is so gorgeous one of the canon characters just can't resist, or when an OC is always right, always perfect and always desirable. Just as frustrating is the constant man/maiden in distress that can't take five steps without canon characters rescuing him/her (Of course, this can be hilarious and entertaining if used for satyrical/comedic purposes).
I personally tend to try and keep my OC appearances brief in fanfiction because I'm afraid of going to deep and putting too much focus on them, but I have an awful tendancy to go overboard anyhow. Others might have more restraint than I do.

Generally speaking, I don't do OCs in fanfiction, except for villains or random people to cause humorous situations. My villains can be either mysterious or really, really in-depth, although I prefer the former. If I start getting into the heads of the more twisted ones, I start wanting to hide from my hard drive, and that is never good for a fanfiction. With original stuff, though, I don't mind getting into the villain's heads as much, usually because that is generally the point of the story, and I enjoy making crazy-detailed backgrounds for my OCs outside of fanfic way too much.
In short, with original stuff, I like to make my characters detailed so that they're more interesting for both myself and whoever's reading, but in fanfic, they're mostly there to compliment the main characters.

It depends on the fandom, for me. I only read fanfics based on games I've played, and I prefer them to be fairly consistent with the way the game set-up without going so far as to be a complete rewrite. If it's based on something like Tales of Symphonia, where there's a fixed number of characters, a set leader and you don't create a player character, it feels like a self-indulgent intrusion suddenly having a new one turn up just so they can smooch their favourite character.
If it's based on a game like Hordes of the Underdark it's a different scenario. There you create the player character and have a strictly limited number of henchmen, one of whom (possibly two with if it's a male character) has the potential to romance your character. In that case, I fully expect to see an OC in a fanfic related to that game and it doesn't come across as jarring - I'll evaluate it from there based on how they portray that character. The story would have to be changed pretty radically to avoid that scenario since the player character is really set up as entirely central to the story. Same with Neverwinter Nights 2, only there are more companions around.

I write OC in different fandoms but I keep the past of the OC a mystery till I need to give it out.
But for my original stories, I usually discuss it within a few chapters or so.
Beth

In some ways, I do and yet I don’t really care whether every reader even likes any or all of my characters much less holds out hope for some form of redemption.  I will provide the redemption in my own way, even though most will not see it.  As with all things, there is a balance most commonly sought between the readers' perception of right/wrong, good/evil, etc.
The character traits that I tend to instill within my original works are more along the lines of attitude and personality because it's so much fun to let out the evil now once the reader has 'fallen in love' with the character.  Unless of course, they're looking for a goody-goody which is entirely boring!  Characters that have the ability to reach out and grab the hearts and minds of the reader should be just as diversified (within the contextual setting) as people are in real-life.  People, in my opinion, are like diamonds, there are many facets to an individual personality.  Which one sparkles depends greatly on which way you turn the diamond, so it should apply to characters.
I’ve read through numerous stories in the archives and honestly, the ones I love the most are the ones that hold my attention because as a reader there is some level of redemption sought, but it’s the fact that I didn’t get my way that makes the story so much more appealing to me.

Trust me, I spent a long time working this out.
Well, when people read fanfics, they look at say... some Anime guy, and they think "Baby I'd like to be fucking him." Or that they'd like to be saving the day.
But the Mary Sue, she's too perfect to pretend for to be the reader. She's too fantastical, with her colour changing eyes and hair and bullshit. Too powerful. She lacks our flaws. We can't pretend she's us, and worse still, we know that she's somebody else's fantasy to fuck whoever.
So, we can't possibly be the ones fucking or saving or starring. It's somebody else who's the star, and we can't pretend they're us, or that they'll fall for us, because they've already fallen for somebody more perfect than we could ever be. In other words, we hate Mary Sue because we are JEALOUS of her. She makes us feel inadequate.
Example - sometimes I sit back and pretend that I (as a robot) can participate in my favorite show and am pairing up with the nearest hot guy. Everybody's welcome to their own fantasies. But I can't hook up with Prowl if he's already hooked up with some other OC - not just a regular OC with flaws who's deep and willing to learn, but something that's perfect, something I could never win the guy off, something I can't pretend is me, something I cannot measure up to.
Anti-Sues are similar - you know, those things so full of flaws but still adored? Well, this time Anti-Sue is loathesome - but she still gets the man. Why would a hot guy ever want to hook up with somebody so mentally disturbed? Why does she still get the spotlight?
The real problem with the Mary Sue is that usually the only person who can identify with her is the writer. Her personality, looks and perfection are just too hard for a reader to identify with. And we're jealous that she's got the man we wanted, that she's in the setting we want to see ourselves in, that she's perfect but we can't be. And why shouldn't we be? Mary Sue has everything we desire, but we could never have. The hot fantasy robot as a boyfriend, the good looks, the adoration - and though she's got a million friends, there's no way we would ever be friends with her because she's too freaking-ass self-centered. And on top of all that, all the important things in this world we once loved are now happening to her. True, in the story, she has to be deeply integrated, but she's always there, involving herself.
If I think of more, I'll add it, but that's a start to why we hate Mary Sue.
We are JEALOUS.

Well, that depends… what exactly do you expect to get from being redeemed? Absolution? I don’t have any kind of faith, so I’m afraid that’s out for me personally. *g*
If a character has done bad stuff, there’s not much they can do about it but resolve to do better the next time that situation presents itself, but it’ll always be something they did. In terms of story, it’ll always be part of their background. It’ll be on their sheet, so to speak. And that’s not dissimilar to life. A blank slate is impossible. Forgiveness might be feasible, but then again in my eyes even that might not save a character.
Say at some point in the past a character has committed a murder, or even some stupid petty crime like a theft. They might spend the rest of their lives (in the story) doing the right thing. They might do more good than all the other characters put together, but that initial crime is still impacting upon everything they do, not just altering them, but altering the whole storyline around them in its turn. And because of that, it’ll always come back to get them. Everything in a story is significant, even a dropped handkerchief. Going on from that, every action a character takes is significant, and redemption is a cheat. It’s an attempt to delete the handkerchief. It’s already written. It’s already done. There’s no changing it. There’s no escaping it. There’s only dealing with it and writing the consequences of it right up to the very end, whatever those consequences turn out to be. 
To redeem a character in those terms… impossible. It’s like Astinus says to Raistlin. You may as well throw a pebble into a fast flowing river. It changes nothing. History continues.