Xenobia

Let me put it this way: Movie theaters are a place for everyone to go and enjoy films. Some of those films are rated for mature audiences ® and anyone under seventeen (unless they've changed this requirement) cannot purchase a ticket for them or attend a showing without an adult present. Just because some films hosted in said theaters are for children does NOT make that theater FOR children. Say a kid gets a fake ID and sneaks into an "R" rated film. Should the producer of said film be banned from showing his or her movies at that theater again? Should the movie itself be removed from the theater, because someone's kid snuck into it despite the rating and now the parents are irate? Of course not. Parents attempting to sue a theater for showing an "R" rated film would be laughed out of court, and there's only so much a theater (or any establishment) can do to detect under-aged visitors. Despite the fact that billions of under-aged people sneak into theaters, buy smokes and alcohol worldwide despite clear warnings that these products are not for those under a certain age, somehow beer still manages to get sold, R-rated films are still featured and cigarettes are still available to all. If Fanfiction.net wants to become a "Teen and under" site, that's fine. They can't logically do so while allowing an "M" rating, though. I'll leave you with a quote that I think really highlights this issue: "Censorship is telling a man he can't have a steak just because a baby can't chew it" — Mark Twain.

I strongly disagree that it isn't in part a parenting issue. Fanfiction.net is not a kiddie site and it never has been. It's a general fanfiction site, and if it were only meant for children then they would not allow a huge chunk of the fandoms they host in the first place. It's not unreasonable to suggest that a site which seems not to want mature content to simply REMOVE the "M" rating and thus eliminate any confusion over such things. Hosting Mature rated content but expecting people not to upload mature content is two-faced, at best. They're best off just dropping the rating system down to teen and lower, if they need to devise a different standard for what "M" ratings actually mean. And YES, it is irresponsible for parents to complain about their offspring reading mature content on a site that allows mature rated material. I'm amazed anyone would actually try to argue that. I've made it clear on my website that my stories are for mature audiences and I'll be DAMNED if any lazy, irrational, unreasonable "parent" ever gets me to censor my own work because their offspring defied my ratings and warnings. This is not something that should even be argued about. Parents should raise their kids, not the internet. If a site wants to allow minors without a filtering system, they should not allow mature content or ratings, period. Fanfiction.net did so in an effort to draw more traffic, and it worked. Now they have turned around and decided they don't want Mature content after all, yet they contradict themselves. As I said in an earlier post, Battlestar Galactica isn't porn, yet there IS SEX AND VIOLENCE AND BLOOD. It is an "M" rated show. According to FF.net's warped standards, shows like BSG should not even be listed on their fandom list. It's bullshit.

They don't have any rules demanding exclusivity to this site, VannuroRB. You have the option of featuring a story exclusively to AFF.net if you want to, but it's not required. A lot of people here have their fiction uploaded to more than one other location.

Well said.

I considered uploading "watered down" versions of my work there and linking back to here for those who want to read the real stories, but I'm running my own site with my original fiction on it and it wasn't worth the effort of going through all that trouble for fanfiction, to me. I think people that choose that route are probably doing the smart thing and saving themselves a lot of frustration, though. It all depends on your personal schedule and what you're willing to do to follow their puritan guidelines, hehe. I too signed the petition, but I doubt it will make a difference. I'll bet someone's paying them money to keep that place nice and censored.

This is pretty much exactly what happened in 2002, yes. I yanked everything and came to AFF.net just to be safe, but I'll admit I started putting stuff up there again after a while, because I saw that adult material was still present and I wanted to get more feedback to help me improve my writing. These days, the reader feedback is really the only thing that makes FF.net worth uploading to anyhow. I yanked my material again, the moment I heard they were doing another figurative book burning. I doubt I'll ever upload to that site again, even if they do back off this witch hunt and start taking a more logical approach to preventing unsupervised kids from reading things they oughtn't be reading.

You know, it's funny...under every other circumstance usually means one can expect violence, sex, blood, death, swearing or drug abuse of some sort to be included in any given "M" rated form of entertainment, yet FF.net has a different standard of what constitutes a mature rating. I'm having an argument with a FF.net advocate over what is widely acceptable in an "M" rating. He doesn't believe sex scenes or graphic violence are a part of that, and belong only to an "MA" category. If sex acts or violence aren't included in an "M" rating, then what the hell is with all these evening television shows with the soft-core porn and the blood and gore? How do all these crime shows or doctor shows manage to make it on the air during primetime, with all the fucking, fighting and crude language they use? The problem as I see it is that FF.net (and evidently, some of their supporters) aren't willing to accept that "M" rated entertainment does sometimes have sex, violence and other mature scenarios. Not everything with a sex scene is porn and not everything with a character death or bloody is a snuff story or film. To me, it's like trying to compare a show like Battlestar Galactica (which does has violence and sex, but isn't raunchy about it) with a more raw, sex and violence driven show like True Blood, Game of Thrones or Sparticus. They're generalizing too much and I think they've either got some immature minds running the show, or they're trying too hard to bubble wrap the site for the sake of complaining parents and they just aren't willing to openly admit they don't want anything higher than a teen rating on their site. They know they'd lose people in droves, if they were more honest about their heavy-handed definition of what constitues material too "explicit" for a mature rating.

They should just remove the "M" rating entirely. It causes too much confusion, as it stands for "Mature" and people naturally assume that means graphic sex and violence can be included. What they really allow is Teen rated work and their TOS should reflect that. As for underage users, it's the parents' responsibility to moderate what their kids watch, listen to and read. I'm tired of these permissive morons expecting the world to bubble-wrap itself because they're too bloody lazy to actually parent their own offspring. Plopping your kid in front of a TV and going about your business is not childrearing, and the term "it takes a village" should not be taken so literally. That being said, this can only be a good thing for AFF.net, and I hope people begin leaving more feedback to encourage writers to keep sharing their work here. One of the (only) great things about Fanfiction.net was that one is guaranteed to get some kind of helpful feedback from the audience, which helps authors determine what can and should be improved and what they're doing right. Sadly, that kind of feedback is rare here and on most other fanfiction sites.

Thank you, I got it working. I had some problems with my browser and finally got it sorted.

Seeing how crazy the Tiller Killers are, I think adding "abortion" might just cause more problems for the site. I'd hate to see AFF.net suffer threats of violence from people that think "free speech" only applies to them.

*hugs*

I've just finished the story that provoked the Tiller Killer to come out of the woodworks. The character in question was dating an avatar and she had some tests run to be certain they couldn't reproduce. The test results proved that it was possible and she had a talk with her avatar boyfriend about it and informed him that she was glad they had started using protection, because trying to bear a Na'vi sized child could kill her. Somehow, this person got the idea that a woman discussing birth control options for her own protection was a selfish "baby killer". I don't know what gave her the idea, but she thought Katherine (the character in question) had found out she was pregnant and had an abortion in the background between scenes. That's the part that floored me. There was no mention of a pregnancy actually existing and no mention whatsoever of abortion. There was just a scene in which Katherine discussed contraception with her boyfriend Sebastian and he said he'd rather have her safe and alive than try to procreate with her.

No worries. It isn't the fault of the site at all. I just had to get that off my chest because I felt my head would soon explode if I didn't say something. The person in question revised his/her review after I put up a note in the next chapter stating that the character had never been pregnant in the first place. I can't decide whether I'm more offended that they tried to push their agenda or that they didn't have the guts to leave their blatant stupidity up.

I agree that it would be nice if there was a larger selection of good het and yuri/femslash fiction out there but this is a sort of revolution. Guys like girl on girl action for their pleasure and now, women are enjoying that same thing in reverse. I think that yaoi is such a big rave now because it was "forbidden fruit" before. I've learned that gay men and straight women don't necessarily enjoy the same kind of male on male action. I've been told my sex scenes are too tame by gay men and I've been told they are too dirty by straight women. I've watched and read porn designed for gay men and found most of it not to my liking. I don't know if the original poster is male or female but it can be hard to balance a fiction for an audience, when one half wants it raunchy and raw and the other half wants it pretty and sweet. My suggestion is to find an author you think can provide a good range and contact them. Request the sort of fiction you would like to read and explain the style you're looking for. Maybe the key to finding the best fanfiction is to explain what you want, with enough detail to help the writer. Think of it as commissioning or requesting a piece of art; you have to give them a visual to work with.

I just want the asshole that posted a prolife rant under a fanfiction of mine to know the following things: 1. It is NOT selfish for women to prevent pregnancy, particularly when it could KILL them. Women are not expendable incubation tools to be used by any man that wants to perpetuate his genetics. 2. Abortion was never mentioned and neither was pregnancy. Where you got that idea, I'll never know but for fuck's sake, learn to read. 3. If you're going to go on a big woman-hating bullshit rant that has nothing to do with the actual content of the chapter, at least have the courage to leave your original review there and the dignity to apologize in a different one. If I were as immature, hysterical and crazy as you are, I'd be trolling the living shit out of your uploads right now and voting them down. Fortunately for you, I think prolife nut-cases that bring their bullshit into everything need help; not the harassment they push on everyone else. 4. I really, really hope that you're sterile. You should never, EVER be allowed to have daughters. Fuck you very much. Have a good day.