Metroid - the Bergman Affair feedback, comments, and workshopping

[HunterOpera]

Glad to hear that Bergman will be receiving some attention again soon!

Three months later... the good news is I have a couple of weeks off coming up, which is nice. Been about a year since time off was a thing, so we'll see what that leads to. Maybe I can actually keep a deadline for this?

[HunterOpera]

Regarding Street Masters, Churn Says:

Classy. You've given us a reason as to why this is happening. Now we just have wait and see what cool scenes you come up with. Looking forward to the sexy scenes! XD

I've never been a fan of porn without plot. If I don't have a reason to care, well, why should I care? We'll see if I can actually find the time to develop this further; I've had a couple of people contact me about this and especially Bergman. I've (thankfully) got some vacation coming up about halfway through this month, so we'll see if I can (finally) get back to this and some other projects then.

I've also been toying way too much with TechArts 3d Custom Girl, which is a magical piece of software for a non-artist with a basic grasp of art theory.

[Guest Relativeh]

One of the best parts about Bergman is how you've captured and developed the main character. Samus is a great protagonist, and the way the story has developed shows you really understand the series and the strengths and foibles of the lead. I think I mentioned in a previous post how I'd never heard of some (most?) of the supporting cast before, and yet having read a bit more into them you seem to have captured them better than most of the canon material; thinking specifically of some of the antagonists like Brannigan.

You said in an earlier post it was important to retain all the elements that make the main character so strong, and it's going to be really interesting to see how Samus bounces back from what has happened, and how long that lasts. Will she regain the Power/Varia Suit? I understand (but haven't played it) that Other M establishes that it requires "concentration and mental determination to operate efficiently". In the context of the story you've created, that is certainly ominous

Attacking someone where they feel the safest has always been a powerful theme in stories, and Samus has always felt at her strongest within the physical confines of the Varia Suit.

Coming back to something you've touched on; Samus rarely makes mistakes, and in some of the earlier chapters it was her overconfidence that caused her to make miscalculations, with disastrous results. Given everything she has been through, I wonder if her desire for vengeance could be the next hinge that proves her undoing?

In the meantime, here's some art of the awesome character you've brought to life with your work

http://wen-jr.deviantart.com/art/Samus-Tribute-446614815

http://danielmchavez.deviantart.com/art/Metroid-351617308

http://eddy-shinjuku.deviantart.com/art/SAMUS-I-Can-See-You-Metroid-348940055

http://www.pseudoangel.com/crap/metroid/Kaboom_colour_by_artofalinea.jpg

(linked to the original artist where possible. Sadly artoflinea's deviantart account is deactivated, so that last one isn't easy to find anymore)

[HunterOpera]

Regarding the Bergman Affair, Anon says:

Ugh. Getting frustrated by this up and down ride. Damnit give Samus a break, will ya? Am/am not looking forward to what happens next.

It's a tricky thing to walk, honestly - where does the line get drawn? How much is too much? One can only repeat the same basic events for so long before the get old, and I'm aware that there's a danger of repeating myself without adding anything new the longer this goes. I'm hoping that that the writing techniques i'm fiddling with help, and am pretty confident that the motivation and psychology of the next chapter (which should be posted in the next hour or so) should differentiate what is coming from what came before.

Narrative whiplash is a horrible thing, but I like to think I'm keeping the themes and characters straight. There is an endgame, a definite plan to bring this story to a close, and it does end with a decisive Samus victory. Two more arcs past this one...

Out of curiosity, what are you liking/not liking, and where do you think this is going? Where would you like it to go?

[HunterOpera]

One of the best parts about Bergman is how you've captured and developed the main character. Samus is a great protagonist, and the way the story has developed shows you really understand the series and the strengths and foibles of the lead. I think I mentioned in a previous post how I'd never heard of some (most?) of the supporting cast before, and yet having read a bit more into them you seem to have captured them better than most of the canon material; thinking specifically of some of the antagonists like Brannigan.

You said in an earlier post it was important to retain all the elements that make the main character so strong, and it's going to be really interesting to see how Samus bounces back from what has happened, and how long that lasts. Will she regain the Power/Varia Suit? I understand (but haven't played it) that Other M establishes that it requires "concentration and mental determination to operate efficiently". In the context of the story you've created, that is certainly ominous

Attacking someone where they feel the safest has always been a powerful theme in stories, and Samus has always felt at her strongest within the physical confines of the Varia Suit.

Coming back to something you've touched on; Samus rarely makes mistakes, and in some of the earlier chapters it was her overconfidence that caused her to make miscalculations, with disastrous results. Given everything she has been through, I wonder if her desire for vengeance could be the next hinge that proves her undoing?

In the meantime, here's some art of the awesome character you've brought to life with your work

http://wen-jr.deviantart.com/art/Samus-Tribute-446614815

http://danielmchavez.deviantart.com/art/Metroid-351617308

http://eddy-shinjuku.deviantart.com/art/SAMUS-I-Can-See-You-Metroid-348940055

http://www.pseudoangel.com/crap/metroid/Kaboom_colour_by_artofalinea.jpg

(linked to the original artist where possible. Sadly artoflinea's deviantart account is deactivated, so that last one isn't easy to find anymore)

... and this will teach me to check the forums more often. Sorry for the delay in response.

I'm glad you're digging the psychology of the characters. It's tricky working with other people's ideas, so I've been experimenting with the themes of each and how they all sort of fit together before, well, ramping it off in the direction of porn with plot. There's a strong criticism about stories that feel like they're betraying the characters that are in them, and I'm trying to avoid that - hell, the narrative fail that was Other M was one of the reasons I started writing this in the first place. I'd kill to design an actual Metroid game, or even a fan edit of Other M. There's so much wasted potential...

The psychic portion of Chozo science technology is a strong example of that. You could base an entire game around that alone, and they use it to weaken the protagonist moreso than they have already. So goddamn annoying. I plan on having a lot more fun with the psychic end of this, and sort of hinted at that way back in the Cave Arc.

You're dead on about Samus' lust for revenge being her downfall here - you'll see that in the next chapter, which, again, I'm wrapping up now.

I've got a pretty massive collection of Metroid theme artwork going, everything from DiD to sprite to epic bits of awesome. It's one of the more interesting aspects of the character and the franchise as a whole, is that it lends itself so well to pretty much any setting or set up provided the main themes are kept intact.

[Guest Random Guy]

Its nice to have you back. Really enjoying your story so far and looking forward for more awesome chapters. Keep it up

[HunterOpera]

Regarding the Bergman Affair, ngrey651 said:

This is incredibly misogynistic towards a kick ass female character. It's insulting towards the original source material, it's essentially torture porn, and the motivations of the villains make absolutely no good sense. How would you feel if somebody else took characters that you personally created and had them tortured? This is a spit in the face of Samus. It's been nothing but 30 chapters of pissing all over her and putting her through the ringer for no good reason at all. What are you trying to show? That your villains are fucked up? We already got that!

Let's not mince words: it is torture porn. This story is rife with pleasure used as a weapon to remove agency. It's kind of in the tags and it is very much the point of the story. I'm not saying that it's right, because it isn't. I'm not attempting to defend the logic or ethics in writing this - there are cases to be made for both, but they fall flat upon detailed examination. This is a story about rape, and trauma, the destruction of self, and a very visceral deconstruction of the themes that make up Samus as a character and Metroid as a franchise. It's not a happy story, but it is a fantasy that is heading towards as good an ending as a story like this can have.

I dislike the argument of characters I've personally created being used in such a way, but not because I can't fathom it. I can. There are stories on this site and others that use characters I've created or had a hand in creating that are written totally out of character and, hey, more power to the people writing those stories. Everyone should have a chance to experiment with language and get their kinks out in a way that does not hurt anyone else. I get the argument and I understand why it's useful when dealing with people that do not consider the agency of other people; the catcalling in New York (or in general) comes to mind, and it is a good argument to make towards those who have problem seeing women as people for whatever reason. I acknowledge Samus as a character and agree that she is one of the most badass characters in her medium, Other M aside.

The villains' motivations are based on their psychology, and maybe I'm not conveying that well enough or maybe it's the content that's distracting from what those motivations are. The crux of everything in the Bergman Affair is Melissa herself, a biological computer with a nigh incomprehensible personality based intelligence planted into the cloned body of human Samus Aran. I figure Melissa is maybe five or six years old, and while bright and capable, utterly lacking in true empathy or emotional maturity. There's a running theory that we (humans) can't remember the first year or so of our lives because our brains are busy making sense of the information that are senses give us; it's an explanation of why blind people can't make sense of visual input even after having their eyes fixed. We learn and evolve our processes based on that learning.

Because she lacks that basic evolutionary step, Melissa is without sanity. She has access to information the rest of us can only dream about and an emotionally scarred attachment to a mother figure, and possibly a phobia of Samus due to her origins. She thinks she needs to defend herself from threats she can't really understand despite her intellect, and is desperate for safety and acceptance. It's why she wants her "mother," Madeline. She's also dealing with a body that looks like it's in it's late teens or early twenties, so on top of everything else she's got a massive hormonal disconnect and no previous understanding of what the things she's feeling are. She doesn't want to hurt her enemies, she wants to be loved, and she's too damaged to understand the difference between love and sex.

Madeline just doesn't want to be imprisoned. That's her motivation. She was a high ranking science officer on a black operational science vessel. To say that she's guilty of war crimes would be an understatement, and she knew what she was getting into. Her attachment to Melissa was based on ideas of control rather than affection, which did come later - the question being, were those feelings authentic or a subtle (perhaps even unknowing) manipulation of Melissa using a psychic prowess she probably doesn't understand.

Damara has a victim complex and blames both herself and Samus for everything that happened to her. Samus was her hero, Samus failed to save her, ergo Samus failed her. She's also still in awe of Samus, but if Samus Aran herself breaks under the same treatment that broke her, well, then it's not Damara's fault that she broke.

Vogl is just a greedy asshole.

This is my first real attempt at writing erotica, and started off as an experiment - writing someone else's characters, playing and developing that mythology, and pushing the boundaries of good taste in a genre I'm utterly uncomfortable with. I've since grown comfortable with all of that, though I am uncertain what that says about me. There's a few things I didn't have any interest in crossing (vore, amputation), but everything else was fair game right from the start.

All of which leaves me with a single question: I am not going out and actively getting people to read this or any of my other stories. I know they're for rarified tastes, hopefully of people that understand that this is a fantasy that can, should, and will never be placed into any sort of reality. The tags are right there, and if you've been reading from the beginning, you should know what you're getting into by now. If you don't like it, why are you still reading it?

Look, I'm going to level with you: it's going to get worst before it picks up at the end. Not Ridley-worse, but worse in a while different way. If you're not digging it now, go no further.

For those of you that are enjoying it, well, there's more to come. Next chapter should be up by the end of the weekend, or early next week.

Thanks for reading!

Its nice to have you back. Really enjoying your story so far and looking forward for more awesome chapters. Keep it up

Glad you're digging it - anything that really grabs you about the story or the way it's written?

Next chapter should be up late this weekend or early next week.

[Guest blargh]

Just wanted to say I love your story and how dedicated you are to continuing it and being true to the game's enemies/lore. I love this style of story and I wanted to say that I wish I had half the drive or talent for this that you do. Cheers!

[Guest Guest]

Not bad for what it is. Just be careful not to copy FMC too much. Perhapse Morbid Fantasy will take it off the site since he hasn't touched it in a year.

[MorbidFantasy]

Not bad for what it is. Just be careful not to copy FMC too much. Perhapse Morbid Fantasy will take it off the site since he hasn't touched it in a year.

no one is copying anyone. What is this drama-mongering?

If anything, the posting of Bergman reinvigorated my posting of several FMC chapters.

Inspiration and plagiarism are very different things. I don't think either of us are lifting ideas or plot points from each other, unless you're call both of us being non-con writers evidence of copying.

For instance, a buddy of mine who is a phantom of the opera fanatic recently told me to watch the 2011 anniversary version of the Phantom of the Opera with Sierra Burgess and Ramin Karimloo. If I update FMC within the next week, every one of you who were waiting for me to do so will have Sierra and Ramin to thank, because seriously, watching those two as Christine and The Phantom was pure musical sex.

No really, go watch?v=BKsoF8wdEVE and watch?v=h7IZNfGEcFk

Listen to the lyrics, and watch the emoting. The eroticism is astounding. in the first one, the phantom is basically hypnotizing Christine so she could have voice sex with him, and in the second one, he literally writes a play (within a play) and make her act in it so he could live out his fantasy of actual carnal sex with her.

Watched the whole thing today, and now I've logged into AFF for the first time in months. Time to get crunching on word-sex. Cheerios

[Guest anon]

Just wondering if any more progress, been following the story for some time and love it. Any word on next updates? Fascinated by the structure and also strength of main character in holding strong.

[MorbidFantasy]

Dude Hunter smut-bro where the new word secks?

[HunterOpera]

Just wondering if any more progress, been following the story for some time and love it. Any word on next updates? Fascinated by the structure and also strength of main character in holding strong.

Next update on Bergman and Masque'd Hawk towards the end of April. I've been doing a visual novel to get back in the swing of things, and I should have a Tomb Raider thing up in early April (gonna try and keep that one short).

Samus has a plan to get out of this; the trick is going to be in maintaining it, and then getting to that point.

[HunterOpera]

Regarding Hermione and the Bastet Collar, Midnight_Fairy said:

I found this story disappointing. As a teacher, Severus should of done something to stop this abuse. I mostly skimmed the story, not really reading it. A story like this need better warnings.

I'm not so sure Severus would care. Keep in mind that Neville - who watched his parents get tortured into insanity - still finds Severus to be the most horrifying thing in existence. Severus may be reformed, but he is not a good guy, or a good man. Also, at the point in which this story takes place, I'm not sure what Snape could do against Umbridge, or if he even knew what Umbridge was up to. He might have said something if he did know, or he might not have cared.

As to the warnings, I'll try to be a little more explicit about what's happening in future. Sorry about that.

Regarding Hermione and the Bastet Collar, Heather Williams said:

N-not in front of the cats! That's just messed up. Poor kitties

Yeah. Imagine if Crookshanks had seen what was going on... or Scabbers. Rats really can get anywhere.

... and now I have an idea for a sequel. Fantastic.

[HunterOpera]

Regarding The Bergman Affair, a Guest said:

Honestly, I'm surprised Samus hasn't broken physically yet, let alone emotionally/mentally. You're doing some cruel things to that woman's body and I don't see an end in sight. Is this a story where the hero ultimately loses? It's difficult to see any other outcome at this point. The rug is always being pulled from underneath Samus' feet. With each chapter there's the resigned feeling as a reader.

I'm sure there's an argument that this torture, of both character and audience, has been overly prolonged. It can be really tiring to see Samus fail over and over and over again. I suppose in that regard the reader can certainly empathise with her situation, if that was your intent. I can only assume you know what you're doing though, judging by your commentary, so even though I'm frustrated by the present turn of events I'll be keeping an eye on this

The one tenant from the Metroid franchise I completely refuse to break is that Samus has to win, and she has to do it by herself. The idea for this was to rant against Other M, because I despise that sorry excuse for a story in that game. It's character assassination of the highest order, and I loathe it. So, yes, she will ultimately win, and she's going to do win through sheer force of will. Promise.

Everyone does have a breaking point, though, and Samus is certainly reaching hers. While she is capable of winning and does have a plan (that she came up with back in the Cave Arc), she is being sorely tested. The trick, for her, is in sticking to the plan, which actually requires some... well, you'll see. I don't want to give anything away.

More Bergman Affair reviews, this time from DeathWings500:

Oh come on, really ? We're back to this ? Did you change your mind since the answer you gave to my review on Hentai Foundry ? Because if this is the same kind of slave collar then I have to warn you that your readers SOD, including mine, won't take it well if Samus manage to free herself at this point. You've been doing TOO GOOD a job of breaking her for recovery to even look possible at this point.

As a side note, you should really get around to updating the HF version of this story. AFF's interface is really clunky and annoying.

And, previously: "I'm hoping for a turnabout. That is, Samus still get into sexy shenanigan but ultimately triumph. Other M has spawned so much Samus hate that I'm I'm well and truly sick of it by now, so I'm hoping this story won't end up as just another "Samus is broken and become a sex slave" story like so many other. Also, I enjoyed the beastiality much more then the training portion, that stuff is just boring to me."

Samus is still winning. This is still going to be the happiest possible ending a story like this can have, and she is going to get out of this. The secret of her escape plan is... well, I'm not giving anything away, but it was laid out in the first few chapters and hinted at in the Cave Arc, and I'll be putting a final few hints in the next few chapters until the big finale.

The end she is in sight.

I'd love to update on HF, but I find the submission process infuriating. The loss of spacing drives me utterly insane, and it's pretty much the reason I keep updating here. I've been considering submitting to Ade's Cave, as well, simply because I like a couple of the fics there.

Lastly, Lord-of-Altair said:

These feminist man haters must be new to this site. I mean, they come on to a website that features stories of women getting raped by monsters or roasted alive by cannibal tribes, and they complain about a fictional female character they worship being sexualized? Those man hating feminists need to cream themselves over yaoi and shut their whiny hypocritical mouths. I mean, Samus is not a real person. SAMUS IS FICTIONAL.

And even if Samus was real, she would want nothing to do with a bunch of bra burning fag hag man haters anyways. She has better things to do than burn bras and whine about how men suck.

Sorry, I just had to get this out.

I'm a feminist.

By which I believe that men and women should be given equal opportunity, and that women are people possessed of agency and should be respected as such. I'm a big believer in equality as a whole, and women across the board tend to be treated horribly for really stupid reasons. It's 2016. We should be past this by now. Women mathematicians, scientists, and engineers helped devise the internet, helped get us into space, helped invent the modern world.

That said, yeah, the warning is in the tags: BDSM, D/s, Humil, MC, Spank, Tent, Xeno, Beast, Abuse, BP, Oral. That's a direct copy/pasta. If someone reads that and clicks on it anyway and then is surprised by the content, well, stop reading. I'm not here to offend anyone - I am here to work out my kinks, experiment with some literary techniques, and hopefully entertain some people that are into the fantasy that I am providing, one where no one gets hurt. To your point? Samus is fictional.

Given my understanding of the character, though, I'm pretty sure she's bisexual and she would very much be a feminist, too, although she probably doesn't think about it much. She was raised by bird people, and I imagine that the various hang-ups of her own species came as something of a shock to her, and probably contributed to her exit from the army and the Federation in general.

[MorbidFantasy]

feminism as a word is thrown around too frequently.

It's not like NC and abuse heavy fics like Hunter's or mine actually try to convince our readers that it is a good thing to hurt and dominate strong female characters. We don't exactly portray the rapists and abusers as heroic or righteous.

True feminism is believing that a woman's ideas, opinions, and values are to be held on equal footing as her male counterparts. Trying to attach feminism to arguments on a fan fiction site is a pretty big misappropriation.

Not to mention that if we were to complain about plot choices regarding story content, I would also have the right to criticize the number of "unrealistic" M/M pairings that saturate this place.... but I won't, because that's entirely up to the creative freedom of the authors here, which is what makes this place so awesome.

[Guest Peleus]

Very interested to see where the story ends up. Samus as a character is absolutely fascinating and you've really done her justice here.

A long while back you mentioned that you were looking for writing feedback, as you were experimenting with different styles, or working in new areas. Is this still something that would be helpful

[HunterOpera]

Very interested to see where the story ends up. Samus as a character is absolutely fascinating and you've really done her justice here.

A long while back you mentioned that you were looking for writing feedback, as you were experimenting with different styles, or working in new areas. Is this still something that would be helpful

Thank you. I think it's important to investigate the psychology of a character in order to portray him or her properly; it's why Other M felt like such a slap in the face, because the Samus there did not feel at all like the Samus we had come to know from every other source. I honestly believe Bergman treats her with more respect, which is saying something.

And very much, yes. I'm doing this as much to see if the techniques and methods I'm using to tell stories are working and why they work and, if they're not, where they fail. If you've got something, I'd love to hear it.

[Guest Guest]

Mommy was bad, wasn't she? Poor sick, fucked up baby.

[HunterOpera]

Mommy was bad, wasn't she? Poor sick, fucked up baby.

Whose?

I mean, you can't fault Lara's or Samus' mothers on account of death. Melissa's surrogate mother is terrifying in her own right, and gave birth to a monster. We know nothing about Madeline's mother, or most fictional characters, for that matter. Or their fathers, come to think of it. The real-life person I'm basing the Earl of Faringdon on had terrible parents, but the real life guy actually turned out alright. I'm aiming for more of a douche-bro by way of Ted Cruz vibe, because he is a villain. I suppose he'd veer more towards the 'mommy was bad' thing, but his damage is as much nurture as nature.

And I'm a big believer in nature playing as much a part as nurture in forming a psyche. Are you familiar with Erickson?

Anyways, I need more data. Whose mother? Why are you talking about?

[Guest Guest]

Based on where you're planning on taking the TR story, Faringdon. Also, given where you're taking it, I'll never read another word you write.

[HunterOpera]

Based on where you're planning on taking the TR story, Faringdon. Also, given where you're taking it, I'll never read another word you write.

Fair enough. I'm not going as far as my source material with this one - or even Bergman, really - but everyone's got their limits.

Have a good one.

[Guest Guest]

Very excited for "Reins of the Tomb Raider"! "Lara Croft in Hard Labour" is something of a demented masterpiece in my opinion, and the nicely woven background of this story seems very promising with good characters and a really funny fictional country. Looking forward to seeing where it goes from here!

[HunterOpera]

Very excited for "Reins of the Tomb Raider"! "Lara Croft in Hard Labour" is something of a demented masterpiece in my opinion, and the nicely woven background of this story seems very promising with good characters and a really funny fictional country. Looking forward to seeing where it goes from here!

"Demented" is a good description, I think. That story is going to much further than mine did, and in a very different direction - I'm taking the base set-up, but with a different set of reasons and a very different outcome. I think the last anon thought I was going to end up with a thoroughly destroyed Lara, aged into nothingness, but I've got a very different goal in mind. We'll see if I can make it work.

The country of Parmistan comes directly from a terrible martial arts film from the eighties. I needed a place that was remote, insane, and still politically significant in some way, and this one fit the bill. I'm expanding the mythology and customs based on what was there, and then tying that together with Roman mythology because I needed something worth stealing while also lending itself to the sort of thing Lara would go after, but we'll get a little more into that next chapter.

[HunterOpera]

Regarding "Reins of the Tomb Raider," Fan said:

The suspense is killing me. I need to see what happens next. I love stories about strong women who get broken down.

When it comes to stories about breaking someone down, so do I. There's something about taking something or someone possessed of inherent dignity and then destroying it; attacking the very things that make them who they are. It's a villainous act, fun in play and terrible in reality, but this is safely within the bounds of fantasy. That said, it's one of the things I loved about the works of, say, MorbidFantasy, EvilCareBear, Aksika, ComicCaptor, John Adams, Azazel, Dirk, Blair Brek, and others.

As for suspense, I'm a firm believer in the idea of building to a crescendo. The Usual Suspects, for example, worked as a movie because the whole thing built to a moment, and the suspense of that work was enough to make that one reveal impactful enough to change every movie that came after it. For serious: how many movies have copied the style of that story without really getting the substance? A story needs to grow, and I'm as much a fan of plot as porn, so I'm glad that's working and glad you're digging it. I can only hope the reveal lives up to the build.

Regarding "Reins of the Tomb Raider," Anon said:

Ahh yes, a tale to reasure all fuckless wonders they are not alone in their hatred of all those mean women who find them tactless and creepy. ASSHOLES CAN WIN!!! YEAH MOM'S BASEMENT DWELING ME!

Not sure if trolling or serious. Assholes can win, and do. It's not a good thing, though, but given the kinks of this story the bad guys have to be, well, bad guys. They are terrible people, and James is a horrible person. In this story he's going to win, and that's not okay even in the context of this story. There's a tragedy to what's happening here, which I think is part of the process and part of the fantasy. Enjoy it for what it is, I guess.