Moderator Exodus

[madlodger]

The PMs are private to the ones who sent and recieve them, no one from the Admins to the moderators can see them. The ones who you sent or tried to send a PM to were in fact suspended, which means all aspects of this board is blocked to them - from logging in to getting PMs for a select time frame of which I am not sure of.

So if you sent me a PM, it would remain private between us. No other moderator or Admin would know what you said to me. But if you tried to PM someone who is suspended, you would not be able to PM them till their suspension is done.

Do you understand the PM function now?

Beth

I was never suspended. PMs sent to me did not go through. I was watching people attempting to PM me with zero messages coming to my inbox. I know for a fact that those messages were addressed to me.

I don't believe that PMs are all that private.

[Guest AzaleaWood]

My apologies, Lurker. I didn't mean to, as you put it "call you out". I did read your post thoroughly, and to me it seemed a touch negative. So I was simply asking a question.

I don't blame you for being passionate about this, I'm sure had I been involved, I would be too. The thing about being so passionate about something that seems very "He said, She said" is that no matter how you phrase things, someone will find what your saying about the other person to be negative.

As for the Caps. That wasn't what I meant by "screaming", though again, you are right to assume that those who do not know you would take it that way. I meant that the tone of the post was very aggressive, and angry (at least, to me). Perhaps I should have just come out and said that. Again, apologies.

And as for these infamous four you spoke of... well, I have no idea what that's all about. And please, it was obviously an ugly scene, so don't repeat it for my sake. I don't really need to know.

I think that's all I had to say. Thank you.

[Guest Knorg]

I was never suspended. PMs sent to me did not go through. I was watching people attempting to PM me with zero messages coming to my inbox. I know for a fact that those messages were addressed to me.

I don't believe that PMs are all that private.

Is your sent box full? I knew somebody who couldn't work out why they didn't get any messages when the inbox was empty and it was because the sentbox was full.

On one version of invision power board I was on you could read user PMs in phpMyAdmin. The site that was on, there was a thing in the TOS to say it was done as a spam blocking measure.

It's been ages though, so I can't recall if there was any way to delete them before they reached specific users, though of course users can set their own settings to block PMs for people in PM Buddies/Block List.

[Ginevra]

I have made little use of the PM function until lately. So my boxes could not have possibly been full. Most of my messages were replies to persons who initiated the contact. I hit the reply button and was told the person could not be found, yet the messages were mere hours old and their forum profiles were showing from my end as active.

I did ask people to send me archive recommendations by means of PM or by email. Most of my PM's were regarding that request. If you sent one to me by PM and you did not receive a thank you reply, then either I did not receive your PM or I was unable to reply to you. I am rather compulsive about such things and would have attempted to reply soon after reading the message. Feel free to email me privately if this is the case, that is why I added my email to my signature

I work in an environment where we are reminded on a regular basis that management owns everything and can monitor everything we do on our PC's. Down to the last keystroke, if they should wish to do so. I sincerely doubt this forum software does not allow the administrators the ability to review PM's if they so choose. I should hope they do not, but I have no control over that. I have, and will continue, to treat my PM's with the same care as my forum posts -- i.e. I will assume that someone could be reading them.

[xax]

Regarding messages not sending: the PM limit here is seriously 10 messages, including copies of your sent messages in 'sent mail', and I have no clue if you can continue to send messages once your inbox is full. If your messages aren't sending, AFAIK the only two issues I know of are 'sending to a banned member' or 'mailbox of reciever (and maybe sender) is full'.

Regarding other people reading your messages: I have no clue if there's some admin-only board feature for messing with other people's PMs (if there is, I don't have access to it), but it's certainly possible to read (and maybe remove) them if you have direct access to the databases & some knowledge of SQL.

[DemonGoddess]

The 10 message limit is for "Junior Members". Once you've posted 20 times, you're supposed to change to "Member" which gives you the ability to store 50 messages. I've changed that from 10 to 20, by the way, for junior members.

Once your pm send and in boxes are at max capacity, you have to clean them out in order to receive more. Otherwise, any pm's sent to you will bounce.

[Guest snowfall]

The main forum tech may be at work (she works nights in my time zone), so I thought I'd pop in. From her posts (there is an option to see all of anyone members posts), you should know that she's worked with this particular program for many years. She has posted that there is no moderator or admin access to reading private pm's on this version of Invision and had previously told me the same. Maybe the thing is just too old to find the option. I wouldn't doubt it.

This forum program is an older version that is much different than the newer. Maybe the newer versions have the option of allowing admin access to pm content. I like the idea of having access in order to prevent spamming, particularly of a virulent nature.

No, I don't believe anyone cares to read weird pm's by people they know nothing about. The only reason for it would be suspected trolling disruption and spamming. I can't think of another reason, but I don't have that much experience. Other than something like that, I don't really give a flip about reading someone else's pm's. I have too many other things going on.

I know that the disorganization of the forums causes many posts to be buried and therefore, many questions and answers are re-posted and re-stated all over the forum. So much redundancy that it does get irritating, frustrating, exasperating. Please excuse the mods if they are just as frustrated as you. They are living your nightmare, too.

Some people go into cranky mode when it is necessary to continue to repeat and when people continue to gripe, which is all understandable. Some people, like Jaxxy, go into flowery mode. That's a defense mechanism when health is a top priority. My chest hurts if I get all wound up and I tend to go into a goofy mode. Solaris seems to need a nice long soak in the tub, some nice music and a nap...after milk and cookies, of course. Maybe she isn't the only one that needs that.

It has been a rough few days and the most I've done is watched and once tried to pull some people into a discussion. Imagine the horror for those doing damage control. I'm super glad that I haven't been required to engage. Solaris has been most active in attempting to quell the battles and wars by giving out information and explanations and I think she is running toward burn out. "Take a breather girl."

I'm not certain whether or not it was clarified, but the main forum tech explained to me that the resignations were not deleted, but moved to another area where they would not cause discord. I have no clue how that works. For the most part, it has been working. And I think that is a really good thing. I wouldn't want to come here and have to be subjected to all of the potential vitriol and subsequent wars.

If you think that the owner is going to let anyone traipse through the site programing that needs some major defense while damage is being fixed just so that you can say, "Oh, sorry, your not a liar. Your techs were telling the truth!" Think again. That's just retarded. *rolls eyes* Very very bad things could happen and the site could be destroyed in one fell swoop.

Is that what you want? Do you want someone else sticking there fingers in there? Do you want to try to read the php code? Can you? Or do you just want to add more fuel to the fire. That's what it sounds like, an invitation for another skirmish. Trollish behavior if you ask me. And not good for you. Seriously, aside from all the rules, you are taking years off your life over something that will not change.

Personally, at this point in time, I know enough to be sick and don't want to know any more. It is one of the reasons that I haven't bothered to read the resignations and to stay away from the majority of rioting threads. As long as the damage is fixed and the place stays up, I'm not complaining.

What I am happy about are the soon to be improvements. It has been a major pain in the ass to try to find things around here that I want to read about. That will be fixed with majorly awesomeness upgrades that are sorely needed. And we get some cool goodies along with it. It's not any different than keeping your programs on your computers upgraded. Don't ask me what. I'm Invision stupid.

I think that what the tech was trying to say was that this forum compares to my dinosaur of a computer. The php code itself had to be re-written by its makers because of the problems on this version. Talk about out of date. Maybe this will help with the stupid 10 limit on the pm's. That's ridiculous. Someone here should be asking for an answer about that. It would be constructive.

Eventually, there will be goodies for the site. I think there is a thread wish list around here somewhere. With the site being so large and needing so many repairs, we aren't gonna get our wishes for awhile. However, I'm damn thrilled that there is now access to some features by those people who are not logged in users of the site. We can count on more new reading material and hearing from our happy reviewers who don't want an account.

Some of my most honest and helpful reviewers would not sign up. Some simply for the insult dealt to them. I had reviewed heavily and I had rarely signed in. Keh, if anyone says that reviews are only for the ego, they are sadly mistaken. I was learning to read and write again after ten years. I needed those reviews to find out if I was making progress. Other people need the same kind of re-assurances. Some people don't need it, but those do not need to insult the others. Because of my situation, I made a point to review, especially new authors. So, I'm glad if that option is truly open again. Gah, getting off track here.

I'm glad that the news page is displayed in a manner that new posts will be easily visible.

Far from failing due to destructive behavior, I do believe that the site is actually going to see a blossoming. It is definitely going to be improved and that has been a long time in coming. Of course, there are always glitches when there are so many changes being made.

For instance, many people very much dislike the site colors. Blech. Sorry, Jax. But the current colors remind me of Naraku's puke green and brown tentacles. Gross! So, I'm one of them. There will be experimentation.

Aaaand, some people will scream, which is great. Input is extremely valuable. I could be one of them. Some people will ask why it looks different than everyone else's. There will be, "empty your cache", "the color will look different on Firefox", "adjust your monitor settings," and the like. Been there, done that.

I hope we can get colors that look good on all the different browsers, but not everyone can be pleased. My colors were weird on a small, little-known browser that I had used for awhile.

All of that is to say that the process of change can be a pain in the ass, even if the end product is better. I used the above example because that is one of the simple things that I can easily understand and have experience with.

Focusing on past events that cannot be changed will only pull you down into the mire of misery. Focusing on those exciting things that have been found to be of good use to the members of the forums and to the site is a much more positive and productive approach. If additional funds are needed to help pay for the new forum upgrade, I'm going to be eating ramen and rice for awhile. And a couple of other people, too.

How you deal with the change is your choice. You can make yourself miserable, try to make others miserable, patiently watch, or get involved, be positive, encourage others, or discourage. Your choice, your life on the net. Just be willing and ready to deal with or enjoy the outcomes.

I can't pay for the entire upgrade alone and since paypal has frozen members donations, it is going to be coming out of the pockets of a handful of people. Hell, the site's hosting for the month is only half paid. Thank you very much, DA. I'm sure that the members are very happy. *waves at people who love DA like I used to* We'll try our best to fix everything and get the account paid up. Fortunately, Nexcess.net is wonderful and is giving us a little time. Wish us luck.

Good luck to you. I hope this post has been of some help. I'm off to work on a project for my employer and probably won't be back around tonight.

Snow

[Ginevra]

Whatever the issue was with the PM's appears to have resolved itself for now. I was able to send and receive PM's to those who weren't working before. I wasn't up to my maximum stored messages at any point. I simply don't PM enough for that to be an issue.

I haven't gotten any emails from anyone I've missed messages from, so I think that's about it.

I'm off to bed now. Should have been there half an hour ago...

[madlodger]

Is your sent box full? I knew somebody who couldn't work out why they didn't get any messages when the inbox was empty and it was because the sentbox was full

Knorg, I had a total of 16 messages in my Inbox and Sent Items. The limit is 50, so only about 30% of PM folders were full.

On one version of invision power board I was on you could read user PMs in phpMyAdmin.

Knorg, I believe that Admins on this Forum are able to read member's PMs, delete them and block members from sending and receiving mail. Those are reasonable controls for dealing with Spammers and Site Abusers.

I am none of those people. I am/was a regular Forum user (1155 posts, 7.4 daily posts average, currently) My account was never suspended.

Despite all of that, PM system was turned off for me since around late afternoon October 21. The Forum Moderators Resignation Letters were being deleted at that time, which continued through the nite. Majority of Resignations were deleted in 24 hours or less since being posted. I believe that PM system was turned off for at least that long.

Some people were able to use PM system, some weren't.

users can set their own settings to block PMs for people in PM Buddies/Block List.

Very true, Knorg.

PM Buddies/Block List in My Controls allowes users to block individual users from contacting them. I have never blocked a person from contacting me.

I have not seen any controls which would enable users to block Everybody. Admin has that control.

[DemonGoddess]

Whatever the issue was with the PM's appears to have resolved itself for now. I was able to send and receive PM's to those who weren't working before. I wasn't up to my maximum stored messages at any point. I simply don't PM enough for that to be an issue.

I haven't gotten any emails from anyone I've missed messages from, so I think that's about it.

I'm off to bed now. Should have been there half an hour ago...

I ran a database repair/optimize on that specific table. Something that needs to be done now and again in any case, with the whole thing, but sometimes one particular table may need it sooner than scheduled.

[DemonGoddess]

madlodger,

Are you still having trouble with the pm system? I can tell you for certain nothing was done to your account settings, as it would be me who would've done something like that.

What, specifically is the behavior the board exhibits when you attempt to use the pm system?

Are you able to access your in and sent boxes?

Are you still able to email using the board, even tho unable to pm?

If you are continuing to experience actual technical difficulties, please detail them for me so they can be fixed.

-----------

In response to the being able to read pm's thing. NO, we cannot do that. That kind of function is actually not part of the Invisionboard the way it was written, in any version. Not even for admin users. I CAN obtain use data, but that's all. It doesn't list by specific anything other than day/week/month, and how many users used the pm system for the time frame selected. I can also obtain other statistical information such as posting data (how many over a given period of time), and things of that nature. Those are tools for generating statistical information only. I also cannot access an individual user's pm boxes (in and sent), nor delete any stored message files. Just like the rest of you, I can only get to my own.

I also do not have access to external database maintenance programs, nor do I want it. It's not necessary for what I need to do with the forum software, or for the routine maintenance that I run via the admin panel for the forum database itself. Sure, a person can access data via phpmyadmin (external database maintenance program) provided they have the access to do so, but it's unnecessary and certainly unwarranted. Not to mention a HUGE waste of time. That goes for ANY php program which runs off a database, not just this forum, as far as being able to look up a table record.

As to the resignation posts, those were moved, not deleted. Sorry, but 52 individual topics all over the place like that constitutes spam to me. ONCE per user would've been more than sufficient.

Personally, I don't see the need to continue beating this particular dead horse, do the rest of you?

[madlodger]

As to the resignation posts, those were moved, not deleted.

Where to? Are they available for public viewing?

[DemonGoddess]

Not currently no.

[Ravenbell]

Where to? Are they available for public viewing?

See Oishiichan's post on the first page of this thread for a link to a saved copy.

Edited October 25, 2007 by Ravenbell

[Guest The Lurker]

I promised I would be good, I promised I would be good. But I have to say this.

See Oishiichan's post on the first page of this thread for a link to a saved copy.

Ravenbell,

You are being very rude and showing no respect for this forum and the AFF site.

Your quote above proves it.

madlodger asked if the posts were available for public viewing.

DemonGoddess061 who is an administrator said and I quote

Not currently no.

Then you post to see Oishiichan's post for the link.

That is being disrespectful to an adminstrator.

If those posts were moved to a private area, that is because of the reason ( I gather) is that what happens with the AFF staff and in those staff lines should not be shown to all the members of the board.

I think of it this way. You work at a private place, say XYZ. Things happen within your workplace that isn't really no ones buisness.

And then later on, your buiness, being work is broadcasted to everyone public.

I would be very upset.

As for Oishiichan's post. I believe what he or she is doing is wrong also. He or she wasn't a mod, so therefore, he or she had no right to save those posts and place them on a page then link everyone to them.

As I said before, you are being rude to the administrator and to the forums. If an administator or even a mod says no, then that should be respected.

If you were an administrator on a site and you said no, then a person posts like you did, being rude and disrespectful, would you not be upset?

I don't believe the forums are hiding stuff but I do believe their resignations were rude to the site to post them public. But then again, that is just my opinon, everyone has one but please, pay attention to the posts before you do something like that again.

Treat others how you want to be treated.

[Guest snowfall]

Well, I guess that everyone should be allowed to break TOS and ruin the atmosphere? It seems to be what this is all about. Ruining the atmosphere as opposed to keeping TOS. A bit trollish in anyone's book.

No one says that a member must like the owner or the mods. No problem with that. What is important is the condition of the environment. Poisoning the water, polluting the air, etc., is not acceptable...and against TOS.

Accept it. If a member can't, then the member really has no need to be here toxifying the environment, ne? Logical

[Solaris]

I agree with Snowfall, it is time to push this to the back of our minds and forget this and move forth.

There is good news coming for the site and the forum and I'm sure everyone is really looking forward to it. So lets look forward to the upcoming good news and move on.

It's time to let this drop and move onto something better.

Okay?

Beth

[Guest Knorg]

...people can change their own phrases in the control panel. Click MY CONTROLS, then in the left side bar is Personal Profile, under that click Edit Profile info, then put whatever you want into Custom member title.

Knorg,

Did most of the otters. Because otters are far more terrifying than Panthers, as panthers usually keep themselves to themselves unless you're raiding their fridge for entrails.

Who ever changed our long-time friend's side bar needs to cut the fuck out. That's childish and hurt her feelings

Oh dear. That sounds like very serious business indeed.

[Guest snowfall]

Thank you for hurting her, Knorg. I'm sure that you are very proud of yourself.

[Guest Knorg]

Whoa now. Wasn't intended to hurt feelings. I admire a good rant.

In fact I was just saying earlier that with the current lack of Moderator staff around here I could not understand why a promotion had not already been enacted for The Lurker. So far as I have seen all of the talents required for this role are held by said user. There's the eloquent and passionate defence of this archive and the principles for which it stands, the loyalty to the leadership, and so on.

[Ravenbell]

What the mod did in question was deleted their spamming resignation posts, that's all. You can find their posts in the forum that you saw them at.

You didn't seem to have a problem with the acccessibility of the resignations two days ago. Or the link that was posted.

Of course the members aren't going to forget this so easily. Your staff walked out. You think that's some minor glitch you can sweep under the rug? You aren't going to win anyone over by ignoring and covering up the issues. If you really don't want to give us any information, at least have the good grace to stop pretending that everything's all right. It's insulting.

I'm perfectly willing to wait and see what happens, but from the responses in this thread so far, the paranoia and the culture of insularity are clearly still alive and well. Don't get me wrong. I want all these grand plans of yours to succeed, but you've given me no reason to belive that they will. From that last post of Jaxxy's she made it clear that we can expect site disruptions for the next several months until things are "normal." I think I'm justified in being worried.

And will someone please tell Rhoda to calm down?

[Guest snowfall]

There are at least eight mods, many new and they are basically awaiting instructions. In the meantime, my offer to help in an area that could raise funds during the hardest time of the year for AFF was shunned by someone who appears to feel threatened by the presence of the new mods. I can only try.

There will be so many changes to the forums very soon, as DemonGoddess has stated, that putting them into action at this point may actually be premature. But they are there.

Snow

[Ravenbell]

Whoa now. Wasn't intended to hurt feelings. I admire a good rant.

In fact I was just saying earlier that with the current lack of Moderator staff around here I could not understand why a promotion had not already been enacted for The Lurker. So far as I have seen all of the talents required for this role are held by said user. There's the eloquent and passionate defence of this archive and the principles for which it stands, the loyalty to the leadership, and so on.

Seriously?

Edited October 26, 2007 by Ravenbell

[Guest snowfall]

You didn't seem to have a problem with the acccessibility of the resignations two days ago. Or the link that was posted.

Of course the members aren't going to forget this so easily. Your staff walked out. You think that's some minor glitch you can sweep under the rug? You aren't going to win anyone over by ignoring and covering up the issues. If you really don't want to give us any information, at least have the good grace to stop pretending that everything's all right. It's insulting.

I'm perfectly willing to wait and see what happens, but from the responses in this thread so far, the paranoia and the culture of insularity are clearly still alive and well. Don't get me wrong. I want all these grand plans of yours to succeed, but you've given me no reason to belive that they will. From that last post of Jaxxy's she made it clear that we can expect site disruptions for the next several months until things are "normal." I think I'm justified in being worried.

And will someone please tell Rhoda to calm down?

Were you worried during the periods of time that the site was down several times a day under the previous four mods?

I truly do not understand this interest, by a tiny faction of people, in the subversive posts that have been properly handled by TOS guidelines. The only explanation for the constant desire to expose members to that strife is an intentional desire to harm the environment. Intentional, with foreknowledge of the effects. If you are so interested, copies of those can be found on other sites, as I'm willing to bet you know.

I also do not understand why people refuse to acknowledge that fact that Jaxxy owns the site, as well as the forums, and all decisions are made at her discretion, despite the small handful of dissenters. It's almost as though people have forgotten that this forum is only continuing to stand because of her good graces.

There doesn't seem to be, by a small number of people, any appreciation for the forum or the site whatsoever. Which means that the site's and forum's continued existence is less important to these people than getting attention from mods and the owner.

For a couple of years, I hunted, databased and deleted trolls from AFF. This is quickly becoming a troll situation, and it will not continue indefinitely. So, make the best of it while you can.

Snow

[Guest Knorg]

To Ravenbell: Fnord, Sir. That is all I have to say to you.

To snowfall: Can I get banned from using this forum? I fear my throwaway remarks will cause offense to some sensitive soul, and I should not bare the guilt of this unintended crime for long before throwing myself in anquish from the highest mountain in The Netherlands, and then wandering through the daffodils for all eternity (or until the sea level rises) howling my spectral shame.