Slayitalldown

I would be devestated if (should I ever be so fortunate) I had an editor who told me I had made almost no mistakes and still had a bad story. I know that magic puts a body on the bones but I need to find out what these 206 bones look like so I can put stuff on them that makes them pretty to look at and fun at parties!
I have the sticky parts, the gooey bits and the wobbly peices but when I put it together it looks like... Abaddon, before she 'Thinged' her hands back on.

On the subject of beta readers... I no longer use a beta reader for fanfiction purely and simply because I write big chapters and I'm impatient. I haven't built the kind of relationships online or in real life where 'hey, read this 10,000 word chapter? kthnxbai' is an acceptable utterance. Maybe its a personality flaw... I actually have a word-count limit dividing 'favor' and 'work'. Seriously, I would rather be a good enough writer that in fan fiction its not needed and as you say, in real life a professional is paid to wave a cat o' nine tails and scream "type, monkey!! Type faster and better!!" at me while I cower and desperately try to please.
There doesn't seem to be an in between market of beta-editors who cater to wannabe authors, those stuck in limbo between wanting to be good enough to be professional and not having mastered/perfected the skill despite a vast knowledge or god forbid, the education and training. If I was to send out a manuscript and it was sent back with 'no thanks' and nothing more I'd be driven to suicide. Not because I consider my writing a precious baby or expect it to be a masterpiece at the first, second or even seventieth draft before an editor would take it but because I have done everything in my tax bracket to learn, study and understand this craft. Unfortunately life tests you first then you learn a lesson, not the other way around and writing to write as best one can is hard without a patient beta armed with a red pen. The other issue is that despite understanding the need, I don't believe in the possibility.
I'm sorry but I don't believe in the unicorn that is a real-live human being with the experience to guide the leap across the chasm from wannabe to potential by saying 'sure! I would love to set my time aside to do that for nothing!' on a full-sized manuscript so I've aimed for being as good as I can be with what knowledge I have gathered and turning it into practice where-ever possible. I simply assumed that once I was brave enough to feel that what I had produced was worthy of at least an agent's time, the terrible and brutal experience that is making the dream come alive would begin as it does for everyone else without a 'writing-nanny' to see me off.
I am sure a beta would be amazing but I'm a kid from the school of hard knocks and we look at unicorn pictures but we know they're not real. We get our hands dirty and our armpits sweaty and we try and try and try out little hearts out but anyone who comes along to say 'hey, why don't you do it the easy way? I know a guy!' usually goes missing, never to be found. Its a long-held natural suspicion of shitty human beings (it could also be cultural) coming to take, rob or steal from the niave and thanks to being churned through that grinder in ways that shattered my life more than once, I have become perhaps a little protective of my writing in the sense that I would rather do things with the lights on... in an office where everyone can see me. I know that might be a self-imposed stumbling block but thems the cards I gots to play with.
I can't think of anything to make this less personal so I might tap out of this topic. I feel a bit nudged out anyway, but I did appreciate all the time and effort put into the answers I got and hope this helped out a few others as well.
Thanks, Slayitalldown.

Sometimes I quietly wish there was a simple system built in where you can score out of ten for a story you've read or a poll: "Liked it", "Didn't like it", "TL;DR", "YAY PORN!" and "We need to talk." to shortcut the anxiety of trying to say something you don't want to be attacked for!

Well, then. There's really no refuting that. I think I'll have that response cast in marble and passed to my descendants.
And you threw in the formula - three crises, I haven't found it ever so eloquently and simply outlined. And I was TRAWLING the other day (when I can't write I read and by golly I READ) for a simple breakdown of 'chapter goals' to help me outline and I stalled. All I could find was the 'first chapter goal' - hook the reader, introduce your characters, ground them in the setting, give them a puzzle to solve.
Then I could find a damn thing.
I got so hopeless lost in trying to make goals I implored my writers group for help and recieved a scathing response to the concept of plotting. Their philosophy was an adamant 'just write, like travelling across country by only what you can see in your headlights'.
I was so intimidated by the staunch opinion being expressed (in the area of "plotting is for sissies") I didn't even begin to point out that I am currently in the middle of an extensive road-trip and I rely on three electronic devices, a map and a compass just to get from one town to the next. Flexibility I can get on board with but no plotting leaves me cold with terror.
Mind you, the Nanowrimo approach scares me too. If I were to drive the way I write it would be with my maps in front of me and my eyes on the rear-view mirrior.
Come to think of it, now I understand why my every attempt at writing dies at the end of the driveway...
How is it a person can be entirely self-aware, have an arsenal of information and STILL be so utterly clueless until the obvious is pointed out?!?!?
This is why I'm not spy!!

I read this and laughed. As a writer, this is my formula. No, not the 'get-straight-to-the-sex' part, but the focusing on plot and characterization as opposed to rushing into the good stuff, which in my opinion is typically overrated. It's a bonus, but not the goal I am striving for. And I have to admit that it irks me when folks pass up a story simply because it's not riddled with grammar and spelling errors, missing punctuation or the use of too many. Or lacking that immediate gratification with the use of fluff, cuteness, straight-up sex. But who am I to tell those people what they should or shouldn't like? *shrug* In any case, I don't think I can add much to the definition of what 'good writing' is. Everything BronxWench wrote is what I feel good writing should be. Aside from the technical stuff, it becomes very a individual matter, straight down to the genre, setting, time period, sexual orientation, so on and so forth. Good writing is much too detailed to fit into a general description, but you're always going to have a critic or two. Not everyone is going to like what you write, and as long as you have a firm grasp on how to properly use the English language (or whatever language you're writing in), what you like to write is not necessarily going to be the issue.

Sometimes I quietly wish there was a simple system built in where you can score out of ten for a story you've read or a poll: "Liked it", "Didn't like it", "TL;DR", "YAY PORN!" and "We need to talk." to shortcut the anxiety of trying to say something you don't want to be attacked for!

Bless!
Funny story - I received a mod review the other day and was devastated that I couldn't find an address to send flowers!! I had no idea where to send my profuse and overjoyed thanks for being noticed. It was one review but it was a major "SQUEE!" moment. I'm sorry, I don't care if its an expected custom it was an honest review and I'm taking the time to take what has been said on board.
I love praise. Its built into the human condition. Actually, its built into the social mammal condition - I've trained dogs and horses and I work with special needs kids and I promise you there are some personalities out there that would die of starvation and thirst if they had a choice between sustenance and praise. Its essential. It kills me when I read something I can't offer praise on. Concrit yes but actual praise... sometimes its nearly impossible to provide without omitting the truth which really, boiled down, is on the same par as lying.
Something I find difficult with reviewing is the problem of 'So, what does the author want to hear?'. Okay, yes praise but... what else? My fear of reviewing is much like my fear of commenting on a friend approaching my and saying 'how do I look' without context. If they're dressed in jeans and a jacket and they're going to a wedding well... not so good but without context... fine...? Covered to the extent society dictates, appropriate for the weather, reasonably fashionable and tidily presented? Reviews that are vague 'Good story, nice work' feel cheap. Okay, yes, praise - yay - but I hunt stories to entertain me. I can't leave a review for a story I skip out on half-way through because I lack interest in the content on a personal level, it would do the author no service at all. Even worse for an author to get a review on a story I have no investment in. If I say something like 'I got to the part where x and y went to the shops, lost interest and flipped over to twitter' I don't have anything for the author to reflect on other than I have symptomatic ADHD.
If I read a WIP and make it through more than one chapter I will leave a review of encouragement but I prefer PM conversations where I can interact with an author. "I liked this but this seemed a little unclear, was that intentional?" This kind of back and forth interaction is so much more satisfying than a public review - and I can dig out the author's intentions. "I write for myself and I like to a little ego stroking." is very easy, "Great story *pat pat pat* good for you *pat pat* keep up the good work *pat pat pat*" where as "I'm not sure if this is right, I glossed over this, I got lazy here and this part I guessed... they do that thing, right?" is so difficult to glean without discussion, and I feel publicly going through something like that is the rude option - especially when I like to site references and refer to further reading with things that need improving. Of course, if the author believes they are perfect in every way and their story is a work of genius I'm not the best person to disillusion them... I reference my advice because I do so much research of my own and a PM out of the blue - "Yo, your story could use some improving, here's the list." is confronting. I'd be confronted by it. Particularly if it was in an area I wasn't interested at that stage in reflecting on, or its part of a set up for something further down the line like fore-shadowing. A reviewer deserves to be thanked and appreciated for taking the time, not sized up in a hostile 'Excuse the f*ck me??' kind of way. Of course, it all comes down to wording but blunt bitches like me always get the short message wrong.
I remember receiving a text message from a complete toss-pot - seriously, the kind of person you wish you could go to their mother, slap her and say "You should have swallowed, you selfish cow, now we all have to suffer" - that said "I don't like the tone of that last message." And all I could think was "Tone. REALLY? A three word message with the depth and sophistication to have a tone??? F*ck me, I'm amazing." but it has made me more cautious. I'd hate to rile up a complete stranger with my 'tone'!! Especially when I just want to pay if forward and spread the wordsmith love! So I err on the side of caution and when in doubt, I say nothing.

Pretty much sums up 90% of my reviews anyway!

Bless!
Funny story - I received a mod review the other day and was devastated that I couldn't find an address to send flowers!! I had no idea where to send my profuse and overjoyed thanks for being noticed. It was one review but it was a major "SQUEE!" moment. I'm sorry, I don't care if its an expected custom it was an honest review and I'm taking the time to take what has been said on board.
I love praise. Its built into the human condition. Actually, its built into the social mammal condition - I've trained dogs and horses and I work with special needs kids and I promise you there are some personalities out there that would die of starvation and thirst if they had a choice between sustenance and praise. Its essential. It kills me when I read something I can't offer praise on. Concrit yes but actual praise... sometimes its nearly impossible to provide without omitting the truth which really, boiled down, is on the same par as lying.
Something I find difficult with reviewing is the problem of 'So, what does the author want to hear?'. Okay, yes praise but... what else? My fear of reviewing is much like my fear of commenting on a friend approaching my and saying 'how do I look' without context. If they're dressed in jeans and a jacket and they're going to a wedding well... not so good but without context... fine...? Covered to the extent society dictates, appropriate for the weather, reasonably fashionable and tidily presented? Reviews that are vague 'Good story, nice work' feel cheap. Okay, yes, praise - yay - but I hunt stories to entertain me. I can't leave a review for a story I skip out on half-way through because I lack interest in the content on a personal level, it would do the author no service at all. Even worse for an author to get a review on a story I have no investment in. If I say something like 'I got to the part where x and y went to the shops, lost interest and flipped over to twitter' I don't have anything for the author to reflect on other than I have symptomatic ADHD.
If I read a WIP and make it through more than one chapter I will leave a review of encouragement but I prefer PM conversations where I can interact with an author. "I liked this but this seemed a little unclear, was that intentional?" This kind of back and forth interaction is so much more satisfying than a public review - and I can dig out the author's intentions. "I write for myself and I like to a little ego stroking." is very easy, "Great story *pat pat pat* good for you *pat pat* keep up the good work *pat pat pat*" where as "I'm not sure if this is right, I glossed over this, I got lazy here and this part I guessed... they do that thing, right?" is so difficult to glean without discussion, and I feel publicly going through something like that is the rude option - especially when I like to site references and refer to further reading with things that need improving. Of course, if the author believes they are perfect in every way and their story is a work of genius I'm not the best person to disillusion them... I reference my advice because I do so much research of my own and a PM out of the blue - "Yo, your story could use some improving, here's the list." is confronting. I'd be confronted by it. Particularly if it was in an area I wasn't interested at that stage in reflecting on, or its part of a set up for something further down the line like fore-shadowing. A reviewer deserves to be thanked and appreciated for taking the time, not sized up in a hostile 'Excuse the f*ck me??' kind of way. Of course, it all comes down to wording but blunt bitches like me always get the short message wrong.
I remember receiving a text message from a complete toss-pot - seriously, the kind of person you wish you could go to their mother, slap her and say "You should have swallowed, you selfish cow, now we all have to suffer" - that said "I don't like the tone of that last message." And all I could think was "Tone. REALLY? A three word message with the depth and sophistication to have a tone??? F*ck me, I'm amazing." but it has made me more cautious. I'd hate to rile up a complete stranger with my 'tone'!! Especially when I just want to pay if forward and spread the wordsmith love! So I err on the side of caution and when in doubt, I say nothing.

Well, it has been a busy month here at AFF! I apologize in advance, but there is a lot to cover – I’ll try to keep it succinct but informative.

Welcome To the FF.Net Refuges!
Meet our newest Moderator
How to ask for tech support
Where to ask for Tech Support
Known Issue: Center Login Box
How to correctly upload chapters
Code Update
PayPal Balance & Donations
Archive Clean Up & Moderation Status

We’ve already posted a special announcement welcoming our new members, but I’d like to just point people to it that may not have seen it yet.
Since June 4th we’ve seen 11,000 plus new members join, a record month for us here! Their additions to the site have brought us to 115,139 total stories with anywhere from 800-1,000 of those being new to the site. We averaged over 120k visits a day! We had over a 600,000 unique visitors (a more than 30% increase) accessing over 100 million pages in June alone.
We’ve also seen the addition of another new member to our moderation team. She goes by the name SmellsLikeJapan both here and on the archive. Apparently neither of our two newest moderators are chatty Cathy’s. She gets along well with Bronx since they both seem to be afraid of the newer smartphones, using an old school flip, but SLJ has added a mustache to hers! Add in that she prefers men’s deodorant and flower scented candies and you have one hell of a bio. Hey, they give me the info, I just write it…
Since we’re talking about moderators: I just want to cover a few basics. We are not FanFiction.Net. We are not associated with them in anyway. We actively moderate our site, but there are 10 of us vs 141,000 of you. We are all humans, with lives and issues outside of the site. We all volunteer to do this and many of the staff spend as much, if not more, time here than with their paying full time job. We aren’t unfeeling robots, we love this site which is why we do what we do.
We are open and available to all of our members; however, I feel the need to remind people of proper etiquette when requesting help. When you need help, please remember we are here to provide it – Like I said, we are outnumbered 14,000 to 1, so please when you ask for assistance remember to be polite and non -confrontational. We always endeavor to be polite but we also don’t tend to sugar coat our responses as that simply draws the process out and doesn’t do anyone any favors. There is a difference between polite and rude.
Polite: Your answer can be found in our FAQs, if you have questions after reading please let us know.
Rude: Are you really so dumb that you can’t read the FAQ?
Polite: The issue with your disclaimer can be found by reviewing the FAQ we linked to in the initial review.
Rude: We told you already, fix it.
Polite: We appreciate feedback, but as previously stated we are in the process of a code re-write.
Rude: READ before bitching please.
See the difference? Like I said, we are human beings. When you come at us with vitriol, it takes every single ounce of strength we have to provide that polite but blunt response. When you threaten to leave the site? It’s hard not to just respond, “Don’t let the door hit you were the good Lord split you…” We work hard, we respect you, please respect us in return. It will make the entire process much more pleasurable on both sides. Make sure you read through the provided links in any review/email you receive and if it is for general support, remember the more details you provide the better!
Now, how do you go about asking for assistance? You can email us, find us on IM or the forum:
If you email us, anything related to tech support should be emailed to technicalsupport@adult-fanfiction.org and anything related to a review or emailed warning from our moderators should be sent to tos_team@adult-fanfiction.org
If you go to the forum, there are a couple different forums to use: Forum Support for forum issues and Archive Software for issues with the archive. Neither of these is for general questions, FAQ requests or search requests, nor are they suggestion forums. If your post is not in the appropriate section, it will be removed.

So now you are in the right spot, how do you ask for help? Like I said, ask nicely! Please include any and all details. We’ve apparently had a bug since the software roll out in February, but it wasn’t until a user walked out each individual step she did that we discovered the issue 4 months later. Step it out, “I clicked this and this came up. Then I did this.” When we send out specific instructions to you, please follow them to the letter, there is a reason we send as detailed instructions as we do. If they don’t work, tell us where it went wrong. If we don’t have those details, we can’t duplicate the issue.
Remember I mentioned that bug we didn’t find for 4 months? Well, that affects the center login box. This box should only be used when you are registering for the site or activating the new code. Once you’ve completed registration/activation, please use the log in fields in the upper right hand corner until this bug is resolved. If you log in via the center box to review, you will not stay logged in. If you log in via the center box to add/edit a story, you will be redirected to a page with only the header and footer information.
Let’s talk about how to add stories and chapters. I know those of you coming from FF.Net are used to uploading your stories. It works a little different here at AFF. You can only upload .txt files and they must contain text containers. Otherwise you will end up with one solid wall of text that is virtually unreadable. You can review this FAQ for step by step instruction.
Some final things to wrap this new post up:
We’re still hard at work on the code re-write. Manta is working diligently especially with the influx of users, but we won’t roll anything out until we are sure that it works correctly. Last thing we want to do is cause more issues! I can’t promise a date for the next code roll out, but I can tell you that our goal is to have this completed by the end of the year.
For those of you coming from FF.Net, you’re probably very used to large amounts of annoying ads, pop ups, etc etc. We don’t do that here. Since we don’t use a flashy advertising system we don’t bring in the large bucks that other sites do. We have small banners at both the top and bottom of the page that will not interfere with your browsing experience. Those banners and your donations keep this site running. Right now our PayPal balance is standing at $766.70 which includes $140 in donations! Most of that will be going to pay our balance to Manta for the new code, so your donations are always appreciated!
Archive Clean up is still on going. It had to take a back burner for a bit with the code roll out and the influx of new members, but DemonGoddess has been back at it and finally finished the emergency repair in Books>A through F.
As for archive Moderation – Well, as exhausting as this last month has been from a moderating stand point, we are still working our way through. Take a look to see what our moderators have been up to here.
Happy Reading & Writing!
Apollo & DG